{"id":10197,"date":"2019-03-19T14:49:05","date_gmt":"2019-03-19T14:49:05","guid":{"rendered":"http:\/\/www.jmhartley.com\/HBlog\/?p=10197"},"modified":"2019-03-19T14:49:05","modified_gmt":"2019-03-19T14:49:05","slug":"frazer-thrulines-part-2-beverly","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"http:\/\/www.jmhartley.com\/HBlog\/2019\/03\/19\/frazer-thrulines-part-2-beverly\/","title":{"rendered":"Frazer ThruLines Part 2: Beverly"},"content":{"rendered":"

In my last Blog, I looked at ThruLines as they related to Frazer descendants<\/a> and I Frazer DNA Project I have been working on. I looked specifically at Joanna’s ThruLines. I am so fortunate that she caught an error in one of her ThruLines (and subsequently passed on when I wrote my last Blog).<\/p>\n

Fixing Joanna’s Thruline Error From My Last Blog<\/h3>\n

Here is the error:<\/p>\n

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Joanna points out that she cannot match these descendants of Edward Frazer. That is because the Edward Wynn Frazer born 1842 shown above died as a bachelor:<\/p>\n

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Here is the correct Edward Wynn Frazer – also shown as one of Joanna’s ThruLines, but a generation later:<\/p>\n

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That means that Joanna’s 2nd great-grandfather and her great-grandfather both had brothers named Edward Wynn Frazer. I had this right in my Frazer Chart (the part I cut off in my previous Blog).<\/p>\n

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I’ll add in WG to my chart to make it clear:<\/p>\n

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I have WG in blue as I don’t believe this person has uploaded to Gedmatch. That also changes these numbers:<\/p>\n

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I had to change everything but the match initials:<\/p>\n

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This brings CK and DK into line with WG’s results. Now what is confusing is why WG at 18 cM and DK at 7 cM both had a 12% chance of being a 3C, 1R. Perhaps it is based on a curve that goes down and then up again (or the other way around).<\/p>\n

Back to Beverly and Frazer ThruLines<\/h2>\n

Beverly shows up in the Michael Branch of the James Main Line of Frazer’s:<\/p>\n

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Beverly’s ThruLines shows a lot of potential ancestors. That is because Beverly’s tree is missing ancestors at her grandparent level. Beverly has her paternal grandmother as a Fraser:<\/p>\n

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However, the line I am following is Beverly’s maternal grandfather (Shown at ThruLines as a Potential Ancestor):<\/p>\n

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As a potential ancestor, Beverly’s grandfather Fitzgerald is outlined in dotted lines.<\/p>\n

Fortunately Beverly’s grandfather is from Kathy’s tree:<\/p>\n

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Kathy is someone I recognize from the Frazer DNA Project. That gives me confidence in her tree. I don’t see any DNA matches at this level, so I’ll go up a level.<\/p>\n

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Still, no DNA matches are kicking in. Another tree has joined the group. However, the Fitzgerald in the ThruLines Tree seems to be the same Fitzgerald that I have on my DNA chart.<\/p>\n

Beverly’s 2nd Great-Grandfather Archibald Born 1801<\/h3>\n

Here is the next level up:<\/p>\n

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Now we see Ancestry’s computers are working hard. They have three trees and two DNA matches to add proof that Archibald is Beverly’s 2nd great-grandfather. I pull down the arrow on the right next to Beverly’s ‘2 DNA Matches’ to get this:<\/p>\n

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Now I want to see if Ancestry likes the match numbers Beverly has with Bonnie and Judith:<\/p>\n

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So far, like Joanna, Beverly’s percentages are on the low side. In addition, I know that Gary should be on this Branch also and doesn’t show as a match to Beverly.<\/p>\n

This Archibald married Catherine Knott who also shows as Beverly’s 2nd great-grandparent in Thrulines. I checked and Beverly has the same DNA matches at the same levels using the Catherine Knott connection.<\/p>\n

Next Up: Beverly’s 3rd Great-Grandfather Michael Frazer<\/h3>\n

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ThruLines show that Archibald had two siblings: Henry P and Margaret Frazer. This siblings had descedants with DNA matches to Beverly. Ancestry is still working hard on this one. I count seven different Ancestry Trees in this visual above. The tree at the top is from Frank. I have Blogged about him previously<\/a>. However, I don’t have the Henry P Frazer Line on my DNA list. I have been tracking Margaret Frazer as one of my own ancestors, but I haven’t been able to place with certainty where she belongs yet. Ancestry seems to want to put her under Michael Frazer. Another interesting thing is that I have Frank’s line under Michael, but Ancestry doesn’t show that – perhaps because Beverly does not match Frank by DNA. Frank’s tree has him descending from a son of Michael named Fitzgerald Frazer. As an aside, Frank has a DNA match with Joanna who was the topic of my previous Blog. As another aside, Joanna had Margaret Frazer as possibly being a daughter of Michael Frazer in her tree. I asked her to change that to her Archibald Line to see how that effected ThruLines. Her change didn’t make any difference in this ThruLine – at least not yet.<\/p>\n

Henry P Frazer<\/h4>\n

Under the Henry P Frazer Line there are four DNA matches:<\/p>\n

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These four all have fairly good matches to Beverly. Ancestry uses at 20 cM cutoff for fourth cousin.<\/p>\n

Margaret Frazer Born 1794<\/h4>\n

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I notice that this Margaret Branch is listed at the half<\/em> 4th cousin range. The explanation that comes to mind is that Ancestry thinks that Michael had more than one wife. In the image above, there are three trees represented. Those trees are from Al, Joanna and Keith. Al shows Margaret as the daughter of Michael Frazer and Margaret Stewart:<\/p>\n

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This could explain the half relationship issue. I thought that I saw a tree that had Michael married to a Mary Stewart. Now I can’t find that. I’ll leave it up to the James Line experts to figure this out. The bottom line is that I think that the half relationships shown for the matches in the Margaret Frazer Branch are wrong. I’ll look at this more in a subsequent Blog.<\/p>\n

Here are Beverly’s matches with those descending from the Henry and Margaret Branches:<\/p>\n

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After the slow start with Bonnie and Judith, these percentages are actually quite high. For example, Mollie’s small 6 cM match is one that would be expected 27% of the time. This particular 6 cM scale tops out at 33%:<\/p>\n

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I am finding the percentage tables to be very helpful. In the above example, it may not have seemed that 6cM was a good match, but according to Ancestry, it is in this case.<\/p>\n

That is of great interest to me as I descend from Margaret also. So, to the extent that we have confidence in Beverly descending from Michael, it would seem that Margaret and her descendants also descend from Michael. That is, assuming also that there are no other connections that we missed. One of the main connections could be through McMaster. However, if Beverly has no McMaster connections, then it would seem more likely that Margaret descends from Michael Frazer.<\/p>\n

I’m sure I’ll be returning to the Margaret Frazer topic. Members of my family match Beverly’s match Keith and I wrote a Blog about that here<\/a>. However, our families’ primary match with Keith appears to be through a closer McMaster Line.<\/p>\n

Up To James Frazer of Clerragh<\/h3>\n

Ah yes, good old Clerragh. Here is Cleragh:<\/p>\n

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My Frazer’s from the Archibald Line lived in Derrycashel. The next Townland to the North.<\/p>\n

Beverly has four DNA matches with descendants believed to be from the Archibald Frazer Branch:<\/p>\n

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This connection goes quite far out:<\/p>\n

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Beverly’s 5th cousin once removed connection with Brittney goes beyond Ancestry’s probability chart.<\/p>\n

Beverly’s Match Probability Chart<\/h3>\n

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The numbers I am most interested in are the percentages. Beverly started out with low percentages with her third cousins Bonnie and Judith. Those percentages went up going one generation back to descendants of Henry P and Margaret who are believed to be children of Michael. Beverly then gets top scores with other matching at James Frazer born about 1720. This is a sort of inverse relationship. One would think that the closer relatives would be more certain, but this seems to show the further away the relationships go with Beverly, the more certain they are.<\/p>\n

Of course, this is all based on the genealogy. If we had decided that Henry P and Margaret had a different father, say Archibald born 1751, then this chart would support that conclusion also.<\/p>\n

Michael Line Genealogy<\/h2>\n

It appears that if I can show a genealogical connection to Michael for Henry Patrick’s descendants or between Michael and Beverly through Archibald born 1801, then that should give a lot of weight for Margaret Frazer being in the Michael Branch.<\/p>\n

Is Henry P Frazer the Same as Patrick Frazer?<\/h3>\n

WE shows he descends from Henry P Frazer. Other trees show a Patrick Frazer. Are these two the same? ThruLines makes the connection.<\/p>\n

Here is the tree for WE and RB:<\/p>\n

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Wejum’s tree stops at Henry P:<\/p>\n

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Perhaps there is some circumstantial evidence in Henry P’s daughter Margaret Stewart Frazer. Michael’s wife was Margaret Stewart.<\/p>\n

Judith’s tree picks up where Wejum’s left off:<\/p>\n

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It looks like Judith made the connection. Judith probably is using this record:<\/p>\n

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Michael from our Frazer DNA group (Archibald Line) provided a Parish Register Record from Eastersnow which showed a Michael and Margaret Frazer giving birth to a Patrick late in 1803. There are some more records for Patrick:<\/p>\n

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If this was the same Patrick, then he would have been a young father of 17. Boyle is about 3-1\/2 miles from Eastersnow.<\/p>\n

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Again, if this is the same Patrick, he would now be 19.<\/p>\n

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Now the question is whether Jane Lacy and Jane Leary are the same person, or are these two separate couples? Did Jane Leary die and Patrick married Jane Lacy? These births are all in the same Parish.<\/p>\n

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This Pat and Jane are now in Aghrafinigan if my records are lined up correctly – in the Parish of Ardcarne. Compare this with Joanna’s Tree:<\/p>\n

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Joanna’s tree references Find a Grave:<\/p>\n

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In addition, Joanna has this Patrick:<\/p>\n

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Joanna’s older Patrick probably accounts for the first three births above as an older dad.<\/p>\n

Back to Margaret. My point is that the Margaret Stuart born in 1834 in Aghrafinigan and baptized in Ardcarn Parish may be the same person in Wejum’s tree.<\/p>\n

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Another interesting point is that Wejum has Margaret’s mother as Jane M Frazer. Joanna has Henry Patrick’s wife as Jane Mostyn:<\/p>\n

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The date looks good. I’m not sure if the location is perfect. More about that later in the Blog.<\/p>\n

More on Patrick and Jane Frazer<\/h4>\n

Here is the family in 1850 in Martinsburg, New York:<\/p>\n

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All children show as born in New York. I am questioning that is not correct. Later in the Blog I prefer the 1855 Census which shows Margaret born in Ireland.<\/p>\n

While I’m In Martinsburg<\/h4>\n

There were other Irish Frazer’s in Martinsburg. I wrote a Blog mentioning Martinsburg in 2015<\/a>. Also living in Martinsburg according to the 1855 Census were:<\/p>\n