Category: DNA General

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Theories on My Mother’s (Rathfelder) Side

I started looking at my mother’s MyHeritage Theories in my previous post and will continue here.

Hannah

I would say the Theory between my mother and Hannah cannot be correct:

For one thing, there are 112 years difference between first cousins Johnn and Ottilie. I was able to find Hannah’s Ancestry tree:

One way to check this is by my Gangnus genealogy book by Gustav Gangnus published in 2003. As far as I can see, Hannah’s tree checks out. That would add a line her on my Gangnus DNA Tree:

Here I have added in Hannah:

Hannah shows as my mother’s 4th cousin three times removed. This makes more sense than the MyHeritage Theory.

Hannah at DNA Painter

Hannah’s match tells us something about a different match:

Notice that Hannah’s DNA match overlaps with Otis. Otis matches my mom in several ways. However, for this segment, the match must be on the Gangnus side. So while the blue segment says Schwechheimer/Gangnus this match is really through Gangnus or specifically through Anna Charlotte Maria Gangnus born 1780:

Hanni

This Theory does not look familiar:

MyHeritage proposes that Hanni from Germany is a third cousin twice removed.

Hanni’s tree has two Gangnus Lines:

Hanni is in another Theory which does not make sense:

Under this Theory, Johann Lutz has a daugther when he is one year old. I’ll skip this one. Theory one is wrong also as the father of Lutke in my mom’s line was Lutke. That means I’m on my own.

Genealogy for Hanni

I will add Hanani to my tree and see if I can connect her. Hanni has her mother born in Hirschenhof which is interesting:

I see in Hanni’s tree that Lydia’s mother should actually be Alide Gangnus.I see several entries for Alide in the 2003 Gangnus Genealogy Book. One of the most interesting is on page 57. This page shows three Gangnus lines. It appears to trace the farms that they lived on in HIrschenhof. Alide shows ther born in 1905 married to Stahl.

Page 129 of the Gangnus Genealogy book shows Alide as the last child of of Johann Conrad Gangnus and Marie Whilhelmie Gangnus. From here is should be easy to trace Hanni’s Gangnus heritage. The first Gagnus to connect with one of my mother’s Gangnus ancestors wins the prize.

So far, my tree is following Hanni’s:

I also have three out of four in the last column with hints at Ancestry. Unfortunately, Johann Georg Gangnus was a very popular name in Hirschenhof:

Actually, I now see where Hanni fits in on my Gangnus DNA Tree:

I see that Philipp Gustave Gangnus is already in my tree, so I can link Hanni’s tree to him. It took a while to fix my Ancestry Gangnus Tree, but I think I have it right now.

Hanni Added to the Gangnus DNA Tree

She and Michael are 4th cousins twice removed to my late mother.

What About Gustav?

I still need to fill in parents for Gustav born in 1809. I do not have to go far to find his father:

Gustav’s father is Johann Georg Gangnus born in 1781. However, Gustav is the son of Johann Georg’s second wife Maria Magdalena Gagnus.

The good news is that the common ancestors are the same:

That means that Hanni and Gladys are 2 times fourth cousins twice removed.

Hanni on My Mom’s DNA Painter Profile

Hanni’s match overlaps with Ruta’s on Chromosome 11. I had trouble figuring out exactly where Ruta fit in as she descends from Gangnus/Muller and Gangnus/Niclas. This tells us that this match with Ruta must be from Gangnus/Niclas. Not that it probably matters, but it is interesting that we can know that from the DNA match.

Summary and Conclusions

  • I looked at Hannah and Hanni. They both descend from Gangnus LInes
  • I was able to fit both of them into my mother’s (hence my) Ancestry Tree as well as into my Gangnus DNA Tree
  • The Gangnus family was prolific. In addition there was a lot of intermarriage of these Gangnus Lines in Hirschenhof. That adds up to a lot of potential for DNA matches and criss-crossing genealogcial trees
  • It is possible to sort out which DNA matches are associated with which Gangnus Lines if we get matches that overlap on a particular segmant on the chromosome.

 

 

 

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Ancestry Frazer and McMaster Clusters with My Two Younger Sisters

I have already looked at some of my own clusters and those with my older sister and brother. To finish the cycle, I will look at Lori and Sharon’s Clusters at Ancestry.

Lori and Mabel

Lori and Mabel are 2nd cousins once removed. Their common ancestors are George Frazer and Margaret McMaster:

They have quite a few clusters together:

One thing that is unusual is that they have two clusters with exactly the same number of matches. I don’t recall seeing that before.

9 Match Cluster

This must be a McMaster Cluster as Keith has no known Frazer ancestry:

Actually, Keith has this Frazer ancestor:

James McMaster married Fanny McMaster and I have her mother is Margaret Frazer.

Cluster of 10 Matches

This tree adds Brad. I do not know exactly how he fits in. Ancestry thinks that John could be his great uncle:

Based on Brad’s last name, he must descend from John’s sister.

12 Match Cluster

Whitney and Stephen are added at the top. They are only the previous Frazer DNA Tree descending from Richard Frazer born 1875. The pink cluster shows how the Frazer and McMaster lines intertwine, I suppose.

The First 13 Match Cluster

Here, BV is added:

BV is an older match going back to William McMaster and Margaret Frazer, so a generation earlier than the common ancestors of Lori and Keith. To confuse things, Margaret McMaster was from the James Frazer Line. Archibald and James were two brothers born in the first half of the 1700’s. I am from both lines, but mostly from the Archibald Line.

The Second 13 Match Cluster

Perhaps Ancestry computers were working overtime on this one. Now BV is gone, so this is not as ancient a connection. It should also be theoretically less confusing. Here Brad is put back in for some reason.

A 14 Match Cluster Bringing Back BV

I feel that BV has a big effect on these clusters:

Ramping Up to a 44 Match Cluster

This is a bit overwhelming:

Here are some possible clusters within these 44 matches that I see:

The first 2 matches are Lucy and Michael. Here is how Lori and Michael are related:

I have been in touch with Michael and Jane who both descend from Richard Frazer:

Here is a new and improved take on this Cluster:

  • The first large cluster descend from Richard Frazer who was born in the later half of the 1700’s
  • Gladys and the small cluster descend from James Frazer and Violet Frazer where Violet is the daughter of Richard Frazer.
  • The next large cluster are descendants of McMasters and Frazers.
  • The cluster within that cluster are Lori’s (therefor miy) more recent relatives descending from George Frazer born about 1836 and Margaret McMaster
  • There should be another box including BV. This is for the more distant connections descending from William McMaster born about 1790 and Margaret Frazer
  • Below BV I see Marshall who has McMaster ancestry. Perhaps he is related on the McMaster side only and not on the Frazer side.
  • Looking at the clusters followin Marshall, they seem to have more affinity to the McMaster or McMaster/Frazer side than the Frazer only side

Lori and Mabel’s 49 Match Cluster

This is a variation of the 44 match cluster:

Here is a simple interpretation:

In between the two clusters is Marshall who I had guessed had only McMaster ancestors without a Frazer connection.

Sharon and Mabel

Sharon is my last sibling tested at Ancestry to Blog about. I also picked her Mabel connection to Cluster:

Where Lori had 8 clusters, Sharon has 6 but of similar size.

As expected, the first cluster has relatives in the 2nd or third cousin range descending from George Frazer and Margaret McMaster:

Correction. Keith is a 3rd cousin once removed on the McMaster side only at that level. That has to make this a McMaster cluster.

10 Match Cluster

Here Whitney and Stephen get added. I believe all these except Keith descend from Frazers:

Stephen is the uncle of Whitney, but I have not added him to my McMaster DNA Tree.

15 Match Cluster

The first cluster is mostly Frazers but descending from the McMaster side based on inclusion of Keith. the second do not have McMaster ancestry and probably descend from James Frazer and Violet Frazer who were born in the first decade of the 1800’s (as were James and Fanny McMaster – the common ancestors between Keith and Sharon).

16 Match Cluster

Very similar to the previous cluster:

47 Match Cluster

Here we have a large leap:

This is a different look. I must not look at Sharon’s results often as some of these names seem new to me. For some reason, with Sharon’s clusters, the Richard Frazer descendant relationships are not highlighted.

Lucas

One interesting match in the first large cluster above is Lucas. He shows this tree:

Lucas shows his paternal line going back to Michael Frazer born 1764. This would be an important connection if true. Here is my great-grandfather’s ancestry:

I have his maternal line going back to Michael Frazer also. My Frazer researcher friend in Scotland also has Lucas in her tree with the same ancestry showing as Lucas. She also shows a DNA match medalion next to his name.

Here is my Frazer DNA Tree for that branch:

If the tree is right, then Lucas should be a close relative to Bonnie. I have access to Bonnie’s results and yes, he does show as her 1st cousin once removed. Based on that, and the DNA connection between Bonnie and Lucas, I will add him in to my Michael Frazer Branch DNA Tree:

It seems a bit random that Lucas would have shown up in this cluster.

I think this is what Sharon and Mabel’s clusters are telling me:

For some reason, Matthew has a lot of matches with all red-boxed clusters.

Mynew

The last match in the cluster group is Mynew:

Here is my Philip DNA Tree:

This seem to be the right connection to my ancestor James Frazer who as I have as the brother of Philip Frazer at the top of the green chart above. I just wish that there were more DNA matches. At the 5th cousin level, it is difficult to get this.

49 Match Cluster

This one is similar but it has LS:

 

However, LS does not show as a match to Mynew. (last match who also descends from Philip Frazer. Based on my green DNA chart above LS and Mynew should be 4th cousins, so there is a good chance that the two may not match each other.

Diane

Diane is also in the cluster with LS. Here is her paternal side tree:

I see she has an Isabella Johnston in her tree This Isabella was born around 1830, lived in Canada, but was born in Ireland. Possibly the relative of an ancestor.

This could be the same Isabella in 1851:

 

Baptiste is possibly her brother – though Baptiste does not seem like an Irish name.

Alannah

Alannah appears as a match just above the cluster that LS is in. Here is Alannah’s tree:

Alannah shows a Frederick Taylor married to a Catherine Johnston from Ireland. In my Philip Frazer Tree I have this:

Philip Frazer at the top who was the son of aonther Philip Frazer who I believe I descend from married a Mary Taylor and/or Gray. Sharon and I could be related to Alanna on either the Johnston or Taylor Line or both.

Summary and Conclusions

  • I looked at the last of my two siblings’ Frazer Clusters at Ancestry
  • I was surprised at how many of the clusters highlighted the Richard Frazer Line except for my sister Sharon. For some reason, her clusters steered clear of this line.
  • it was certainly helpful looking at 5 sets of clusters (mine and my 4 siblings) rather than just one set
  • I was interested in any matches which descended from the Philip Line. This line appeared to marry into the Johnston family and many of the Irish moved to Canada.
  • In some cases it is possible to see in the clusters the familiies of ancestors. In other cases where the families are not easily identifiable, there could be hints as to where the genealogy is going as in the case above with the Johnston and Taylor families of Ireland.
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Clusters from One of My McMaster and Frazer Lines

From studying Frazer DNA matches, I was able to locate one of my Frazer Branches that was more obscure than my obvious line. Here is the closest way to my Frazer ancestry:

My grandmother was Marion M Frazer and her father was James Archibald Frazer. It appears that James’ father George had two Frazer parents. To confuse things more, James’ mother was a McMaster whose maternal great-grandmother was a Frazer. It is this Frazer/McMaster Line that I would like to look at.

My Match with BV

I have a pretty good match with BV considering that she is a 3rd cousin twice removed. Perhaps because of the different ways we are related. Margaret Frazer was married to William McMaster. The family moved to Ontario from Ireland. However, my ancestor, Fanny remained in Ireland and married yet another McMaster.

My Clusters with BV

Here are the DNA clusters that I have with BV:

Before I get into it, it seems my best DNA tree is on the McMaster side:

A 3 Match Cluster

Sometimes simple is better. Here is Robert:

Robert is from the James McMaster Line I was mentioning above. mt must be Robert’s sister:

Here is part of my McMaster DNA Tree:

I added in mt today.

A 4 Cluster Group between BV and Me

I hope that this cluster will be as easy as the first. ck manages B.V.’s kit and is her daughter. It is not obvious to me how Steven and Alannah fit in. Alannah has a pretty good tree:

Johnston is a name associated with Frazer in Ireland. This could be the connection. I have this connection in my tree:

Catherine could be a daughter of William and Mary or John and Jane.

Moving on to a 20 Match Cluster

Here I see 4 clusters. But clusters three and four overlap on Clif and Cluster 1 and 2 overlap on BV and John. This is not surprising considering the Frazers and McMasters intermarrying in my ancestry.

Cluster 1

This is similar to the 3 match cluster above going back to William McMaster and Margaret Frazer. The difference is the addition of Matthew. I know who Matthew is:

Matthew is my third cousin.

Cluster 2

Matthew gives a hint as to Cluster 2. They should be descended from George Frazer and Margaret McMaster. They are all in my Frazer DNA tree already:

I left out my branch, as those matches would be closer than I set the DNA limits.

Some overlap makes sense as we have a McMaster/Frazer cluster next to a Frazer/McMaster cluster.

Cluster 3

I know who Gladys is:

Our connection goes back to two Frazers. Namely, James and Violet:

Kathryn is first cousin or niece to Sandra:

 

It appears that most of the others that I can’t figure out in this Cluster are close relatives to Sandra and Kathryn.

Next is Clif who straddles Cluster 3 and Cluster 4. Here is his tree:

He is also shown as related to Gladys and could be her 1st cousin twice removed. I assume that his connection is on his paternal side which is missing some information.

Clust’er 4

I don’t have a good handle on this cluster. I have been in touch with the administrator for CA’s DNA and she says there is a Frazer connection on her maternal side.

A 26 Match Cluster

These 4 clusters seem someewhat discrete. Cluster 4 does not match with Cluster 3 and Cluster 4 does not match with Cluster 2 except for Clif who I have already mentioned above.

Each cluster seems to go back a generation. Does that mean that Cluster 4 is even older? One common name in that cluster is Acheson. That family lived near my ancestors.

Summary and Conclusions

  • I am still having fun using Ancestry Clusters
  • It is quite helpful being able to choose a person of interest as that focuses the clusters to the area one is interested in.
  • There were no outstanding new revelations, but it is helpful to look at the DNA in a different way
  • There are still other Frazer lines that I may like to cluster.

 

 

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Mapping My Wife’s French Canadian Side with DNAPainter

In my previous Blog, I wrote about my wife’s French Canadian Clusters at Ancestry using her late Aunt Lorraine’s results. This got me interested in mapping my wife’s French Canadian side using DNA Painter. While Ancestry is very useful, it is not useful in mapping DNA as it has no chromosome browser.
That means that it does not have specific information on what Chromosome your DNA match is on.

Marie’s Dad

Richard’s maternal side or French Canadian side:

Richard is 45% mapped. I would like to get this up to 50%. In my last Blog, I was running into problems due to incorrect trees and intermarriage on the French Canadian side.

I’ll start with FTDNA as that site uses the X Chromosome also. I wonder if I can figure out more about Richard’s X Chromosome. Rejeanne has an X Match with Richard:

I actually found Rejeanne at MyHeritage and there is a Theory for her:

This theory looks plausible. From Richard it goes all the way back on the maternal side. Rejeanne has one man, but that is possible, because he would have received his X Chromosome from his mother and passed it intact to his daughter. For this to work, it appears that Louis Girard would have to have had two wives (or perhaps the genealogy is wrong).

Here is the closest link I could find at Ancestry:

This assumes that Pierre-Louis Girard is the same as Louis Marie Henri Girard. Also Louis Marie Henri would have had to have been about 14 or 16 when he married Emerance. This does not seem likely.

Trying Gedmatch

I can see why I have so little matched as it is difficult to track these matches down. Here is Diane at Gedmatch. She is also at Ancestry:

.

Here is her match at Gedmatch (to Richard).

I can now accept Diane’s connection to Lorraine or see if she fits into my wife’s family tree as suggested. I’ll add Diane to my tree as a floating tree and then connect her if it works out.

 

This is Diane’s mother’s marriage record. Unfortunately, her mother’s mother’s last name is transcribed as Semena. I see Simard, though the i is not dotted.

Here is the marriage record for Virginie;

Everything is going smoothly so far:

Except Ozias and Mathilde should not be living. Next, I am looking for Ozias’ mother. Here is the family in 1861:

Genealogists have to appreciate the maiden name of the mother showing in the Census. I’m coming down the home stretch:

The marriage records are quite helpful:

This couple marries in 1842 in St. Urbain:

Next, I need to connectj Jean Baptiste to Jean Marie Tremblay. The writing for Jean Baptiste’s 1819 marriage record is not all that clear:

I will be happy to take the transcription suggestion:

The writing gets even worse for the marriage of Jean Tremblay and Constance Poitvin:

Time to Paint Donna

Here is Donna on Richard’s Chromosomes 2 and 9:

Dona paints a new area on Chromosome 2.

Here are Chromosomes 16 and 22:

There is some conflict on Chromosome 16 as Christine represents Delisle on the Lefevre side. So it is possible I got that connection wrong or there may be more than one connection.

Here is how my wife’s Aunt Lorraine matches Diane at Gedmatch:

Diane adds to Lorraine’s Chromosome2 and 4:

Diane’s match also overlaps with some more recent Pouliot matches on Chromosome 6.

Diane is consistent with other matches on Chromosome 16 and provides Lorraine’s first maternal match on Chromosome 22.

My Wife’s Aunt Suzy

Suzy’s real name is Virginia, just to add to the confusion.

Suzy has a smaller match with Diane at Gedmatch:

Donna paints new regions of DNA on Suzy’s chart:

I like to have lighter colors for the more recent common ancestors and darker colors for the more distant common ancestors, but this takes a while to work out.

Summary and Conclusions

  • It seems like it should be easy to paint to one’s chromosomes, but when I go to try it, it is quite difficult
  • In the past, the best options have been looking at Gedmatch for someone who has their information at Ancestry. That was the case here also with Diane
  • I may want to try to paint some more on my Hartley side next time.
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Looking at My Wife’s Side French Canadian Clusters at Ancestry

I’ll start by looking at my wife’s Aunt Lorraine’s Clusters. Lorraine’s mother was French Canadian:

Perhaps we will see some Lefevre, Methot, Pouliot and Fortin Clusters.

Here are Lorraine’s Clusters including paternal:

The connected clusters 1, 2, 3, 7, and 8 are maternal or French Canadian. Clusters 4, 5, and 6 are on the paternal or Irish side.

It took a while to go through Cluster 1:

I looked at all the common ancestor suggestions and assumed that they were right. Out of 28 matches there were 17 common ancestor suggestions. They all included Lefevre, so I assume that this is a Lefevre cluster.

Here is the overall picture:

Clusters were paternal, so I did not look at them. Lefevre or 1873 had two wives. My wife descends from the Pouliot wife and not the other, so the blank wife (CA2) indicates a half relationship.

The last Tremblay/Bouliet result does not go well with the Methot/Angesrs descendant match as Tremblay is in a different part of the tree:

What I see is that most of Lorraine’s Standard Clusters are on the Lefevre side. A few are on the Methot/Angers side. There are some on the Lefevre/Pouliot side, but those relations are too close to be helpful. This would be at the 1st cousin level. Usually, one looks for the 2nd cousin level or further out to track.

Pouliot Clusters

I can force Pouliot clusters by choosing a person of interest:

I’ll choose 2nd cousin Belharuk. I’ll choose a match level between 30 and 150 cM:

I don’t know why sometimes I get a large cluster to see and sometimes I do not. Here is the first match in the 10 match cluster:

Robin is on the Lefevre side, but her grandmother is a Pouliot. This is very confusing. Here is a situation where I can identify with the Ancestry computers as they are confused also. I better go to Fred’s tree. He is one of my wife’s relatives and I trust his tree:

Fred does not actually descend from Lefevre. That explains Lorraine’s clusters above. Many that are called Lefevre are actually Pouliot. Fred’s tree shows on his paternal side.:

Here is a Pouliot DNA tree I made a long while ago. I believe that it correctly shows the Pouliot relationships:

Here we see Belharuk, Robin, Fred, and Lorraine. Fred, Belharuk, and Lorraine are 2nd cousins to each other and not related on the Lefevre side. The confusing part is that Joseph Martin Lefevre also marries Mabel Ford:

And that is what causes a great deal of confusion.

I am not sure how to fix this at Ancestry.

Here is John in Cluster 1:

He is the third match down. According to Shared Matches at Ancestry, he is the son of Judy. Here is Judy’s tree on her maternal side:

Here, I have added Judy and John to my Pouliot DNA tree for the next time I get confused by what Ancestry is showing:

Back to Lorraine’s Standard Clusters

I just remembered that I can filter Lorraine’s standard clusters by her maternal side:

Cluster 3 is actually Pouliot:

This explains the mystery as to why Lorraine had so many Lefevre clusters. Not all the Lefevre clusters were really Lefevre clusters.

Summary and Conclusions

  • I assumed that the Common Ancestors shown in the close relationships of the  Standard Clusters were right, but many were not.
  • I found this out when I went looking for Pouliot Clusters
  • That means that I should not always accept the close common ancestor suggestions that Ancestry has.
  • This Blog has me thinking about mapping my wife’s aunts’ French Canadian DNA using DNA Painter.

 

 

 

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Looking for Pilling Clusters at Ancestry

In this Blog, I would like to look for Pilling matches. I have a motive for this. Those who are descended just from Pilling will not be descended from Hartley. Theoretically, I could eliminate some of my matches from my Hartley ancestor search. As it is, when I look at many of my Hartley DNA matches, it seems like some of them could be Pilling relatives.

So as I think of the matches, it occurs to me that going forward in time from Mary Pilling, there would be matches that descend from Mary Pilling. However, going back from Mary Pilling, there should be no Hartley descendants that match us unless it is by coincidence. Hmmm…

Pilling Genealogy and ThruLines

I believe that my genealogy is right for Mary Pilling:

However, when I look at the ThruLines for my father’s 1st cousin Joyce, I see this:

This shows Horsfall coming from Robert. Robert died in 1835. May Pilling Hartley remarries Robert Wilkinson and has more children. I thought that the ThruLines were more messed up than they are. When I look at Joyce’s ThruLines for Mary Pilling, it looks correct:

That means that Ruth would be a great person of interest in looking at Pilling Clusters.

When I look at another of my father’s first cousins’ ThruLines, I see this:

Derek has an even larger match with Maury at 42 cM.

Maury’s Pilling Clusters

Maybe my chances of finding Pilling Clusters would be better with Maury than with Joyce.

I was thinking I should see an overall cluster, but I don’t see it.

The first group is the closest group of matches:

EB has a private tree, but according to shared matches, he is a nephew of Derek.

Cluster 2 includes two people from the Wilkinson Line:

Cluster 3

This seems to expand past the children of John Pillng born 1822 for the first three matches of this cluster. This tells me that there are two different groups, but Norman appears to be matched to both. This appears to be where the matches have gone from the known (Pilling and Wilkinson) to the unknown.

Cluster 4

Now that I have not figured out Cluster 3, I will move on to Cluster 4:

This represents the ultimate representation of Pilling clusters that I am aware of on my side’s matches. This would be one interpretation:

I was thinking that the first cluster were people who descended from Mary Pilling. However, George is a new match.

When I look at George’s shared matches, he comes out close to the Wilkinson side. Perhaps I can fit him in. George has an unlinked tree:

George’s mother is from Massachusetts. Perhaps that is a clue.

I don’t know if I have a better Pilling DNA tree, but this one looks like it could use some updating – especially on the Wilkinson side:

I’ll add George to my tree as a floating tree.

I’ll go with the findagrave hint at Ancestry for Barbara – Geoge’s mother:

In 1950 George Nelson is a Taxi Driver living in New Bedford:

His sister Barbara A Nelson is listed in the same household on the next page:

The house is in the Sassaquin neighborhood of New Bedford:

Here is Barbara in one tree at Ancestry:

That same tree has father George Nelson dying before 1930. However, if that is the case, how can he be the father of Barbara Ann Nelson born 1931? This appears to indicate that George died in 1930:

Here is the family in 1940, but where is Barbara? She should have been about 8 or 9 at the time.

It appears that it is not easy for me to trace this match back to Wilkinson and Pilling.

More on William Wilkinson

Shared matches seem to indicate that the George match above could be a 2nd cousin to Richard and Paul:

That could mean that they both descend from William Wilkinson born in 1879. Here is Willia a death certificate for Wilkinson in 1936:

At the time, he was living at Lindsey Street, New Bedford:

Lindsey runs between North Street and Court Street. That confirms that this must be William in the 1930 Census:

According to Paul’s Tree at Ancestry, William had a second wife:

Back to the Clusters

George is somehow connected to the Wilkinson side, but I do not know how exactly. The next cluster is from from Ann Hartley. She was the daughter of Greenwood Hartley who was the son of Mary Pilling.

The Third Cluster

  1. Elliot
  2. Talia
  3. Jane
  4. Catherine

Jane and Catherine are in the order of 1st cousins to Maurey.

They descend from James Hartley. Cluster 2 descend from James’ sister Ann Hartley Burrows.

Elliot and Talia

Elliot’s family appears to be from Tasmania:

As Elliot’s tree only goes to about the year 1900, it would take quite a bit of work to trace it back to the Pilling family.

Cluster 4

The last person in the last cluster has this possible connection:

Victoria fits in with the theory that these should be Pilling clusters. However, the tree goes back quite far. The further a tree goes back, there are more possible ways that something could have gone wrong. Here is the earliest Howorth that Victoria has:

The information looks a little vague. I don’t mind trying a quick tree to see what I get. It looks like I already checked this out in 2019:

I have Edmund’s son Edmund born in Bacup. This is interesting as this is where the Emmet side of family lived. After a quick look at the ThruLines, I do not see an easy connection.

Summary and Conclusions

  • Looking at the Pilling Clusters gave me a different perspective on this family and their descendants
  • The largest result gave me four clusters. These were: Pilling/Wilkinson, Descendants of Ann Hartley Burrows, descendants of James Hartley her brother and a fourth presumably earlier group of Pillings.
  • My assumption was that I would get a list of Pilling descendants that I could eliminate from my list of earlier Hartley descendants. It did not seem to work out that way and/or I did not look at a list to subtract them from
  • I found an interesting match to the Wilkinson line, but could not figure out how he is connected.

 

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An Overview of Upshall Clusters for My Wife’s Great-Aunt Esther

My wife has a late great-aunt Esther who is actually a half Aunt. That means that she matches by DNA on only half of my mother-in-law’s maternal side. This is my mother-in-law’s tree:

My mother-in-law and Aunt Esther match on the Upshall side and not the Daley side. Fred Upshall first married Elizabeth Daley. She died in the Flu Epidemic. He then married Margaret Shave and Esther descends from her.

Here is Esther’s tree:

Esther’s grandfather was born in 1841. That was before there were good records in Harbour Buffet, Newfoundland where the family lived. I believe that a church burned down which did not help in the record department. There are Burtons and Dicks on both sides of Esther’s tree and her parents were related to each other in some way or ways.

Esther’s Standard Clusters

Here we see 5 clusters. Clusters 4 and 5 look like they could be connected.

  1. In this cluster, I recognize everyone as farily close family to my wife except for Stephen
  2. This Cluster has my wife’s aunt – my mother-in-law’s only sister.
  3. I don’t recognize anyone right away. It is a paternal cluster as are all the clusters.
  4. My later mother-in-law Joan is in this cluster. She matches all people in all clusters by at least 65 cM except for Grace
  5. I don’t recognize anyone right away in this three match cluster.

Here is Esther’s paternal side:

After briefly reviewing the clusters, this is what I get:

  • In cluster 1, the matches were too close except for Stephen
  • In Cluster 3, the was one Upshall suggestion and one Dicks suggestion

Stephen in Cluster 1

Stephen’s closest matches with suggested common ancestors are Danielle and Catherine. Here is Danielle:

Neither Danielle nor Catherine are on Esther’s Stard Cluster chart.

Here is Catherine:

So this could be a Dicks Cluster. De

Summary and Conclusions

  • All of Esther’s Standard Clusters are on her paternal side. This could be because many who have tested are also on her paternal side.
  • Esther’s parents were related to each other, so some of the DNA results could be confusing
  • Delving more into the extended clusters would give more results on Esther’s maternal side. However, that is of less interest to my wife’s family as they are related to her on her paternal side.
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Playing with My Children’s Expanded Clusters at Ancestry – French Morrow Side

Expanded Clusters are a good new genetic genealogy tool at Ancestry.

I am more interested in my children’s maternal side as I know more about the paternal side (me). Here is my children’s mom’s tree:

The top half is polish and the bottom is Irish (Warren), English (Gatley) and French Canadian (Morrow/Tacy/Tessier).

Morrow

As I look at my daughter Heather’s ThruLines, I see this:

That is not very encouraging as it is such a small match. I can try clusters based on Erica, but many of these clusters work on a 20 cM match and Erica only matches by 12 cM. I’ll try to cluster on Erica anyway.

This results in 2 clusters. Not bad.

Therese is probably Erica’s niece. Therese has a larger match to Heather, but no tree.

Going back to the larger cluster, it seems everyone is related:

It seems like there are a lot of holes in this side of the tree:

So perhaps I need the genealogy to find more matches and more matches to support the genealogy. At this point, I am skeptical concerning Mary A Cassion’s surname. I did a surname search under Heather’s DNA match names and got no results.

Morrow Genealogy

The 1880 Census for Lowell seems significant:

Here older brother Dennis Morrow has married Sarah Whalen. But where are Dennis’ parents? He is now the head of the househould with his two younger brothers and a brother-in-law. If I can find the birth record for any of these three brothers, I should have the names of the parents.

I was able to find the Roman Catholic record for Dennis’ marriage:

Both witnesses are on the Whalen side.

Apparently Dennis remarries in 1916:

Here we have the mother of Dennis:

My best reading is Mary A Casson. At any rate, she dies in 1876. Her husband dies in 1879. That explains the 1880 Census above.

I asked Google if Morrow is a French Canadian name:

I find it frustrating that I am not able to find this family in Quebec. According to Dennis, he was born in Quebec:

Here is his brother Joseph:

The death record for Joseph in Providence gives some more information:

Here we have his middle name and a different name for his mother. Also, this indicates that his mother was from Ireland. Here the mother’s name is given as Rose Cassin from what I can tell. Another interesting thing is that Joseph dies of gas poison “probably” accidentaly. The informant is his daughter Nellie Glancy. This death record appears to contradict some of the other records concerning Mary or Rose Cassin.

Here is a stone from St. Patrick’s Cemetery in Lowell, MA:

While looking through Naturalization papers I found a different Joseph Morrow who was naturalized in Maine but from New Brunswick;

This is a possible hint to his last name.

Back to the Cluster

MK on the Heather’s cluster above has a tree with a little over 70,000 people. Here is one branch of his tree:

There is even a Jean- Baptiste in the line. I suspect that Joseph Frederick’s father was a Jean-Baptiste (John B.). Here is Louis from MK’s tree:

Here is another tree for Louis at Ancestry:

Actually, this is a Joseph born around the time I was looking for a John B.

Another thing is, that this match with Erica could be on the Tessier side:

Summary and Conclusions

  • I tried to use Heather’s expanded clusters to ferret out some more genealogy on her Morrow side
  • I had trouble with the genealogy as it appears the Morrow name could have be Moreau, Morin, Morot, Morault or something else perhaps.
  • There was one small match between Erica and Heather of 12 cM. This seems small for a 3rd cousin and JJ did not match Erica at all
  • One shared match suggests that the Morrow name could have been Morin. However, the match could also be on the Tessier/Tacy side which is not known to be related to the Morrow side.
  • While researching Joseph Morrow I found some interesting details about his death.

 

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Some Butler DNA Clusters at Ancestry

Since Ancestry enhanced their clusters, I thought that I would try them out on my wife’s Butler Line. I have two of my wife’s tested at Ancestry.

Here is my wife’s father’s paternal line:

Here is my wife’s Aunt Lorraine’s ThruLines on the third cousin level:

Patty seems like a good choice to try to cluster on.

I got some results, so that is good. Here is the 6 match cluster:

I believe that all these descend from George Butler of Cincinatti.

Here is the 19 Match cluster:

Here Patrick is interesting. What I am seeing is that there are two major clusters and Patrick is in-between the two. Patrick is the son of Will:

The common ancestor between Patrick and Lorraine is likely George Butler. He was born some time in the 1700’s and likely from Wexford, Ireland. Lorraine is Will’s 4th cousin once removed and an important DNA match.

Patty is in the cluster above Patrick. This is likely the Cincinnati cluster descending from the George in the DNA tree above.

The cluster below Patrick appears to be from another George. This George was the son of Edward Butler who confusingly also had the birth name of Adam. Edward was the brother of the George who moved to Cincinnati.

So here is what I think I have:

This is what one blogger calls walking back the ancestors.

Unfortunately, there are a lot of Georges here. The lower right corner of the pink cluster is from George Butler born 1872 and brother of Edward Henry Butler born 1875. Patrick descends from the George in the upper right hand corner of the Ancestry tree above. The upper left corner of the pink cluster descend from George Butler born 1826 and brother of Edward “Adam” Butler. I find it satisfying to be able to see all these connections in one place using Ancestry Clusters.

Lorraine’s 30 Match Butler Cluster with Patty

This is no doubt a more detailed picture of the previous pink cluster:

T

Top right is Cincinnati Butlers. Will and Patrick are from Butlers that never came to the US. The tighter cluster is from George Butler. He moved to Massachusetts. I cannot place the last 5 in the bottom right. Lisa has Murphy and other ancestors from Wexford. It is possible that some matches go beyond what we know about in the area of genealogy. This view also includes Patrick’s father Will.

Virginia and Brian

Brian comes up as a large match to the Butler family. He is a fourth cousin to Virginia who is another of my wife’s Aunts. My guess is that Virginia’s clusters with Brian should look very similar ot Lorraine’s clusters with Patty.

 

 

It is a little different. The upper left cluster is the George Butler born 1826 in Wexford, moved to Cincinnati. Actually the common ancestor between Brian and Virginia should be Henry Butler born about 1800 in Wexford – not George born 1826 as stated earlier in the Blog.

Then within that Cluster is Will and Patrick. The common ancestor between them and Virginia is Henry Butler’s father and George Butler and his unknown wife.

The third cluster would also have the common ancestor of Henry Butler but this cluster represents the desendants through Edward Henry Butler down to his son George Butler born in 1872.

Summary and Conclusions

  • Running clusters for my wife’s two late Aunts confirm my previous DNA and genealogical research.
  • Two important matches are Will and Patrick. They bring the Butler connection back another generation in Wexford, Ireland. Their DNA matches also tie together two other branches descending from two son sons of Henry Butler of Wexford: a George Butler Branch who remained in Cincinnati and a Edward Butler Branch who lived for a while in Cincinnati but who eventually moved to Massachusetts.
  • There is also a connection with Brian who descends from the Cincinnait branch, but one branch moved to St Johns, New Brunswick. This connection is important as that is where Edward Butler lived briefly and married Mary Crowley before moving to Cincinnati and eventually to Massachusetts.
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More Frazer Clusters from Gladys

Gladys is a Frazer relative here:

Gladys’ great-grandfather Richard was the brother of my 2nd great-grandfather George Frazer. In my previous Blog, my thinking was that if I used Gladys for clusters, I would get better or older matches. Also these clusters would likely eliminate some of the McMaster Matches as my 2nd great-grandfather married a McMaster.

I chose as a person of interest Mabel for Gladys’ clusters:

Here is Cluster 3. This discovered my family even though they were not explixitly included in the inputs to the cluster:

Jonathan is my brother and the rest are my siblings, my niece, my nephew, my two children and myself. This suggests that of my siblings who have tested at Ancestry, Jonathan should have the most Frazer DNA and I should have the least.

Cluster 4 for Gladys

This cluster has just one more match than the pink cluster above, but my family are now out of the cluster:

I noticed that Zara was a new match. She is also the daughter of Susan:

I’ll assume that Susan knew who her mother and grandmother were. This is Susan’s maternal line from her Ancestry Tree:

It turns out I already had Susan:

I got a little confused. This is an older Richard Frazer Line. The 1830 Richard and the 1852 Richard must have been named for the 1700’s Richard.

I looked at the lower right cluster but could not see an easy connection to any of my identifiable ancestors.

Cluster 5 for Gladys

This looks like two major clusters with perhaps some clusters within the clusters.

I recognize Jane in the major 2nd cluster. Jane and Siddon descend from Richard Frazer born perhaps 1777. I also descend from that line but from Violet Frazer who married James Frazer. So that should be the two major clusters above. First Violet and then Archibald born 1804 – both children of Richard.

 

The last cluster had 60 matches. This expanded things far out:

This one gives me a bit of a headache.

Summary and Conclusions

  • Using Gladys and Mabel to cluster gives some more detail on the different Frazer Lines
  • However, because Gladys is a bit removed from me at 3rd cousin once removed, the results are more obscure than ideal.
  • Ancestry suggests using someone in the 2nd cousin range. I think that makes sense.