Ken’s Newfoundland DNA & Genealogy

I while back, I had emails from FTDNA saying that they had found a close relative for my mother in law Joan and her 1/2 great Aunt Esther. That match was to Ken who had ancestors in Harbour Buffet, NL where my wife’s Upshall family came from. This was good news. I even found an Upshall in Ken’s FTDNA tree. It seems Upshalls are quite rare.

Some Newfoundland Genealogy

Here are Ken’s ancestors:

Compare this to Esther’s Newfoundland genealogy:

Esther’s tree has a few more holes. Also note that her Upshall grandfather was born in 1841, so those holes go back some time. Esther matches Ken on the following surnames:

  • Shave
  • Upshall
  • Dicks (2)
  • Burton

That could be a lot of DNA to untangle. My mother in law Joan only matches Esther on the top half, so that is Upshall and one of the Dicks lines. That is because Esther is her 1/2 Aunt. Fred Upshall married Margaret Shave after his first wife died during the Flu Epidemic.

Ken’s wife Sandi

Ken’s wife Sandi has a Dicks in her genealogy who is from the Robert Dicks line. As a result, Ken and Sandi share some DNA:

Gedmatch estimates them to have a common ancestor at 4.5 generations. Here is Sandi’s tree. She is 6 Generations from Robert Dicks while Ken is only 4 generations away. That averages out to 5 generations to their common ancestor.

Triangulating on the Robert Dicks/Cran Line

When I compare Ken to Sandi, Marilyn, Howie and Forrest, I get this on Chromosome 14:

This shows Ken’s matches with #1 Marilyn and #2 Sandi. This looks like a Triangulation Group (TG). All that is needed is for Marilyn and Sandi to match each other. However, surprisingly, Marilyn and Sandi do not match each other there. They do match each other in a lot of places but not on Chromosome 14:

How can Ken match Marilyn in the same area of the Chromosome where he matches Sandi and not have Marilyn and Sandi match each other? I think that the only way this could happen is that he has to match these two on different copies of the Chromosome. We each have maternal and paternal Chromosomes. That means Ken matches Marilyn on the maternal side and Sandi on the paternal side (or the other way around).

Next, I’ll look at Chromosome 18

This shows Ken matching Molly, Sandi and Forrest. This time, we see from above that Marilyn and Sandi do match each other on Chromosome 18 between 11M and 33M. Here is how I picture their TG18:

From this it would appear that the DNA is coming from Robert Dicks or Jane Cran. The theory is that a TG points to one ancestor. However, in this case we don’t know whether that ancestor is Dicks or Cran. I would guess that the DNA is from Cran. I’ll say why I think that below.

Ken’s Tier 1 Triangulation Report

Gedmatch.com has a utility called a Tier 1 Triangulation Report. I ran this for Ken and found three TGs near each other on Chromosome 18:

The first TG has a lot of people in it that I don’t know. It is represented by the first green segment. There were many other overlapping green segments each representing Ken and two others that I didn’t include in the image above. Molly and Sandi were not in that TG.

The second green segment represents the TG I have above which has Ken, Molly and Sandi in it circled.

The third green segment overlaps with the second green segment. It has has Molly, Cheryl and Ken in it. Prepare to squint:

Cheryl is way over on the bottom left. She is on the Elizabeth Dicks/Adams Line. The Roberts Dicks/Cran Line is cut off on the right. Here I have Ken triangulating from his Frances Dicks/Burton Line and Marilyn triangulating from her Rachel Dicks/Joyce Line. This is truly a Dicks TG as it is coming from three lines. I am thinking that the previous TG with Ken, Sandi and Marilyn is a Cran TG. That is because I wasn’t able to get Cathy and Marilyn to match. If both these overlapping TGs were Dicks, I would think that there would be some match between Cathy and Marilyn. Given the complexities of Newfoundland genealogy, there could be other explanations, but that is the way I see it at this point. Another way to look at it is if the TG is quite wide on the Dicks project, the DNA is probably Dicks. If the TG is narrower, it is more likely that the TG is from the associated surname – in this case Cran. The other point is that Cheryl and Sandi were important in this analysis as they only appear to descend from one line of Dicks each. They helps ground the double Dicks descendants Ken and Marilyn.

The Triangulating Ken and esther

I am interested in how Ken and Esther triangulate. When I searched for Esther in Ken’s Triangulation Report, she came up 45 times. I also looked at TGs that had my mother in law Joan in them. There were about 15 TGs with Ken that had Esther and/or Joan in them. I have done a lot of work on the DNA from the Dicks lines. As a results, I came to the following conclusion:

  1. TGs with Ken, Esther, not Joan and not Dicks descendants were more likely on the Shave or Burton lines.
  2. TGs with just Ken, Esther and Joan are more likely on the Upshall line.
  3. TGs with Ken, Joan and others (not known Dicks descendants) are probably also on the Upshall line.
  4. TGs with Ken, Esther, Joan and known Dicks descendants are probably represents Dicks ancestors.

I also noticed a lot of TGs that Ken had with Esther and people that descended from the Elizabeth Dicks/Adams Line. They are represented in a peach color below:

This TG came up four times. I’m not sure of the significance of this.

Triangulating Ken’s X Matches

Here are a few of Ken’s X Chromosome matches:

#1 is Esther, #2 is Joan and #3 is Molly aka Marilyn. I don’t know 4-7, so I suppose they are not related to Esther, Joan and Molly. It looks like Ken, Esther and Joan are in a TG. They are in a TG as Joan and Esther match from 47M to 115M. We can probably find a common ancestor based on this.

Ken only got an X from his mom, so we can eliminate the whole paternal line:

The purple circles indicate possible lines of X Chromosome inheritance for Ken.

Here is the X inheritance pattern for Esther:

However, here, we need to eliminate the bottom part of the tree as Joan is only related to Esther on the top half of the tree.

Next is Joan’s tree:

This is where things narrow down. I didn’t include Joan’s paternal line as she is related to Esther on her maternal side only. Christopher Dicks the father of Christopher Dicks got cut off, but he wouldn’t be in line for the X Chromosome anyway as the X never travels from male to male. That leaves a connection to Margaret the wife of Christopher who I have as living from 1789 to 1867. That means where Ken, Esther, and Joan match, they can map that bit of X Chromosome all the way back to the Margaret with the unknown last name who married Christopher Dicks.

Margaret goes off Ken’s chart but was the mother of Robert and Frances Dicks as far as we can tell:

We don’t know if Ken’s X Chromosome came through Robert Dicks or Frances Dicks. Molly isn’t in this X TG, so we will say Ken’s X inheritance came more likely through Frances Dicks than her brother Robert.

Molly, Esther and Ken’s TG on the right side of the x chromosome

Esther and Ken have the same X inheritance patter for this TG as previously shown. Here is how Molly connects. All I have to do is show that there is a likely X path to Margaret with no male to male in the line:

I started with Molly’s paternal grandmother. From there I went to Sarah Slade’s mother’s mother who is Priscilla Dicks. From there we go to Robert Dicks and Robert’s mother Margaret who is Molly’s 4th great grandmother if I have it right. The X connection makes for a zig-zaggy route.

The only step I forgot to prove the TG was to show that Molly and Esther match each other at the end of the X Chromosome.

That match completes the TG for Molly, Ken and Esther. That means that if people are mapping their X Chromosome:

  • Ken and Esther can map their middle and last segments to Margaret
  • Joan can map her middle segment to Margaret
  • Molly can map the end of her X Chromosome segment to Margaret

Homework Assignment

All we have to figure is what all these matches represent between Ken and Esther:

Actually, I think that we are on our way to figuring this out. Here is another peek at some of Ken’s TGs with Esther and Joan:

As I mentioned above, it is possible to guess the TG’s routes based on who is in the TGs. My guesses are:

  • TG1 for Ken could be on Esther’s maternal Shave side.This also includes a Dicks and a Burton.
  • TG2 could be on the Upshall side as Upshall is a rarer name and there aren’t others in the TG
  • TG4A has Joan and not Esther, which narrows things down. This has at least on UK person in it, so perhaps this goes back to Upshall in the UK or Upshall ancestors there.
  • TG4B and TG5 have people that are not known Dicks descendants, so that could narrow things down a little. We would have to look more into their genealogy to figure out the connections.
  • TG9A has Joan which probably narrows the lines down to one Dicks and one Upshall. There is also one Elizabeth Dicks/Adams descendant in this TG.
  • These assumptions would have to be checked with the genealogy of the people that are in the TGs.

Diminishing Matches

I showed above how Esther matches Ken at 389.1 cM. This is how Ken matches Joan, who is Esther’s half niece:

The match went down by about half, which isn’t bad considering the half relationship Joan and Esther have with each other.

Here is Ken’s match with my wife, Marie, who is Joan’s daughter:

Wow, look at that. All the DNA matches dropped out except for the one at Chromosome 9. On average, a parent would pass down half the DNA. However Marie got less than average. I’m sure a lot of this DNA went to Marie’s other siblings. The moral of the story is to test the older generation for DNA. Esther shares about 18 times the DNA with Ken compared to Marie and Ken.

Summary and Conclusions

  • Ken and Sandi have provided a lot of information and matches to consider – too much for one Blog
  • I need to do a fuller review of Ken and Sandi’s matches for the Dicks DNA Project
  • I am interested in trying to figure out more about any potential Ken/Esther/Joan Upshall DNA matches. Esther is on AncestryDNA and has some interesting matches with people in Dorset, England.
  • The good news is that there are a lot of DNA matches on a lot of different lines. The challenge is figuring out which matches go with which lines and where to make the connections in looking for missing ancestors.
  • This match between Ken and Esther should be a benchmark for those who have Harbour Buffet ancestry.

 

 

 

Another DNA Tested Dicks Descendant

I was recently contacted by Eric who told me about another Dicks descendant named Clayton. Clayton tells me his grandfather was Leslie Dicks from Harbour Buffet. That is good news as my wife’s Dicks ancestors must have come from Harbour Buffet also.

Here is the match between Clayton and my wife’s 1/2 Great Aunt Esther:

Next, I checked to see if Clayton matched my mother in law. He didn’t. Esther and my mother in law, Joan match on Esther’s paternal side. The fact that Clayton and Joan don’t match could mean that Clayton matches Esther on her maternal side:

Here is where it gets a bit tricky as Esther has Dicks on both sides. I am leaning toward Clayton matching on the Jane Ann Dicks side.

Here is the existing summary of Dicks Triangulation Groups:

I note that Clayton’s matches are in places other than identified Dicks Triangulation Groups (TGs). That doesn’t mean that he doesn’t match. That just means that I can’t prove that he does match based on existing TGs.

Next, I compared Clayton with other Dicks descendants in the 3D viewer at Gedmatch:

Look at all the ‘None’s under Clayton. This tells me either that his match with Esther is on the non-Dicks side, or that he matches a Dicks line that has not been identified well.

Clayton’s Genealogy

From my emails, I get this sketch of Clayton’s ancestors:

Clayton says that John at the top was supplied by Eric. One of the best places for Newfoundland research is called Newfoundland’s Grand Banks Genealogical and Historical Data. At that site, I found a 1945 Census of Harbour Buffet with a Leslie Dicks:

Going back to 1935 shows about the same information:

The only difference being that Ronald is no longer with the family. Also the ages don’t seem to add up all the time. Let’s go back to the 1921 North East Harbour Buffett Census:

This is quite helpful as it gives more relationships, month and year of birth and place of birth. And we finally find Charles.  Here we see that Charles is the brother of Alfred. The two families apparently lived in the same house that year.

Next, I was able to find a marriage record for Charles near the end of 1908:

The best I can figure is that Delilah and Jessie are the same person. I note that one of the witnesses was Elisie Kirby. Esther has Kirby ancestors.

Second Cousins, Twice Removed?

What I notice when doing the genealogy is that Clayton is off by two generations from Esther:

If Clayton and Esther are 2nd cousins twice removed, then the yellow circles indicate where the match could be. Unfortunately, for Clayton, that is in the area of eight unidentified 3rd great grandparents. Actually one of Clayton’s 3rd great grandparents is a Dicks, but the DNA match is not leaning toward that name, from what I can tell. Due to a lack of match with my mother in law, and lack of matches with other Dicks descendants, the match would most likely be on the Shave, Burton or Kirby Lines. In my spreadsheet of matches for Esther, I note that Esther’s matches with Clayton seem to coincide with her Pafford matches. I have noted that the Paffords have Shave ancestors. That may be something to look into. This all confirms the inter-relatedness of Harbour Buffet people.

Summary

  • Esther and Clayton match by DNA and both have Dicks ancestors
  • Analysis of the DNA match show that the match is not likely on the Dicks Line
  • Esther and Clayton also share ancestors from Harbour Buffett
  • Esther and Clayton share matches with the Pafford Line
  • Further investigation of common Pafford matches coupled with further research into Clayton’s ancestry may result in a common ancestor.
  • Also common ancestors along Clayton’s Gilbert Line need to be explored
  • Autosomal DNA can and will come from any ancestor, so all ancestors need to be evaluated.

Addendum

After posting this Blog, I had a few comments. Here is an update from Eric:

I found some of the Charles Dicks data on various trees from ancestry.com.    They indicate he was married to Jessie Trowbridge  (this could be a variation of Strowbridge).    The Delilah Gilbert marriage seems to be a new discovery.    I dug a bit more and I think only Sarah from 1910 was a child of Delilah.    Delilah dies 5 Feb 1917 of TB.   Charles marries Jessie on 29 Nov 1918.

 Just based on the ancestry trees without further research, it appears that the father of Charles was John and John was of Christopher 1829.    That should make John the brother of Catherine who married Henry Upshall.    Because John Dicks apparently married Mary Ellen Shave, Esther could very well be related in more than one way.   The common DNA on chromosome 1 seems to triangulate with A144898 Tracey Crann.

His comment fits well with Molly’s comment:

In reference to the Gilberts, Delilah’s mother is Sarah Jane Kirby who married Thomas Gilbert. Delilah is a sister to my husband’s grandmother, Mary

It looks like I had a 50/50 chance of guessing right on Delilah and Jessie and guessed wrong. Here is a quick fix on the small Ancestry Tree I made for Clayton:

Here is Charles’ 2nd marriage, with Charles listed as [W]idower:

 

More Crann DNA

In my previous Blog, I looked at creating genealogical trees using proposed Crann DNA matches. The matches I looked at were primarily at AncestryDNA. The advantage of Ancestry is that if the matches have trees, they are easy to find. Since that Blog, I had a question from Molly in my Newfoundland Dicks DNA Study Group. Molly would like to know if the DNA shows that she is descended from the Cranns. Molly has two lines of Dicks ancestry. One of them leads back to an early Crann connection.

Molly (or Marilyn) and her brother Howie are on a Dicks/Crann line on the right. They are also on a Dicks/Joyce line. My wife’s mom Joan and Joan’s half Aunt Esther are on another Dicks line. In my previous two Blogs, I got around a lot of the non-Crann common ancestors by finding a Crann descendant who moved from England to New Zealand. This tended to isolate matches to just Cranns and made things simpler. In the chart above, a lot of these people are related to each other in multiple ways due to living in isolated areas. Also Joan, Marilyn, Howie and Forrest did not test at AncestryDNA. Fortunately, they are all at Gedmatch.

Here was the match list at AncestryDNA:

These were presumed to have Crann ancestors. I know that Esther, Heather and Ninky are listed at Gedmatch. There are also others.

People Who Match One or Both of Two Kits

Getmatch has a utility where you put in two matching people and others show up that match both those people. This is sort of what AncestryDNA does with their matching feature. I did that for Esther and Heather. From that list, I found some people that match Heather and also match Esther.

Wayne and Marjorie

Wayne and Marjorie show up first on this list. Marjorie is probably the M.R. listed at AncestryDNA with the large tree. Wayne and Marjorie are siblings. If I’m interpreting Marjorie’s tree correctly, I get this:

This adds another New Zealand line in green to compare with the Newfoundlers. Also on that list of common matches are my mother in law, Joan and Molly who asked about her Crann connections. Forrest, who was listed as a Crann/Dicks descendant was not an obvious match to the New Zealand DNA testers. However, she did show a tree match to John Crann. Based on that, I’ll add Forrest, Molly and Howie:

Forrest also had that John Crann’s wife was Elizabeth, so I added that in. Under this tree, it would not be surprising for Forrest to not have a DNA match as Forrest and Heather would be 4th cousins twice removed. Next, I’ll add my mother in law and her half Aunt Esther:

Note that I just corrected Wayne and Marjorie and moved them up one step after getting in touch with Marjorie’s daughter Donna. In all subsequent diagrams, they should be shown as here.

My next step is to take all the tested people in the Tree above and compare their DNA in a spreadsheet, to look for Triangulation Groups (TGs).

Chromosome 10 TG

Here Heather, Wayne, Marjorie, Molly and Howie match each other. Joan and Esther match each other but not the rest of the group, so they are not in the same TG.

Based on the above, this appears to show a common ancestor of Crann for Marilyn. It’s a little surprising as Marilyn and Howie are 6th cousins to Wayne and Marjorie.

TG11: Heather, Esther, and Joan

I suppose Esther and Joan do not want to miss out on this TG which seems to point to Crann in Netherbury, Dorset, England:

This shows that the DNA that Joan and Esther match with Heather got to them somehow. That path had to be through the Upshall or Dicks wife (or both).

TG22: Esther, Heather, Wayne and Marjorie

Here, the match between Marjorie and Wayne are not highlighted as siblings are usually counted as one person in a TG.

It is interesting that after 250 years, the DNA still points to the Dorset, England home of the Cranns via Newfoundland and New Zealand.

These were only a few TGs. I only picked the DNA matches where there were pretty good New Zealand trees. There are probably other New Zealand DNA tested people that triangulate with Newfoundlanders who descend from the Crann family of Dorset.

If Heather wanted to map her Crann DNA based on these four testers, it would look like this:

 

A Dorset, Newfoundland and New Zealand Connection by DNA: Part 2

In my previous Blog I created a proposed tree based on AncestryDNA matches, Gedmatch matches and family trees. First, I created a more solid Crann tree by patching together existing trees. This would be the backbone of the study as there were pretty clear relationships. It looked like this:

One family had Newfoundland roots (Matson). Heather had New Zealand roots. They both matched by DNA and both had an ancestor in Netherbury, Dorset, England. Based on that tree, I added two other trees based on matching DNA:

One was another Crann tree. The other had no know Crann ancestors but a likely Crann DNA match. I felt comfortable doing that for a few reasons. The first reason was the AncestryDNA matches of the people in the proposed tree:

The 2nd and 3rd columns above showed how each person matched my wife’s great Aunt Esther and Heather. Further, Matson was related to Terence. This created a sort of circle. This is my interpretation of how Ancestry does their circles. The fact that there was this circular matching is in my opinion like what many do with Triangulation of DNA matches. This tends to insure that there is a common ancestor. This could also insure that the match of a match is not going far afield.

The other reason why Heather is an important match is that she is from New Zealand. I assume that her Crann ancestors went directly there. That means that I wouldn’t have to take into consideration Newfoundland intermarriages when considering DNA matches with Heather. In other words, I could assume that Heather was related on one line only. Or at least it would be more likely.

The  Elsie Connection

In the last Blog, I looked at the Terrence – Matson connection. They matched each other by DNA. They also matched Esther and Heather at AncestryDNA. In the same way, I would like to look at the Elsie connection. I mentioned in my last Blog that Elsie had 4 people in her tree. That was not totally right. She has 3 people and one is listed twice. I’ll ignore her grandmother as it is the same person she has down as her mother. Perhaps it was at that point that she gave up on her Ancestry Tree.

As before, I create a new tree for Elsie at Ancestry. I called it the Chafe/Hann Tree because at this time, we know of no Cranns in her ancestry. The problem with that is that we will need to build out both sides of Elsie’s ancestry. As I worked back her ancestry I looked at the Ancestry leaf hints. One hint surprised me as it was the first time I’d come across an Upshall in my genetic research. The fact that an Upshall popped up unannounced while I was chasing a probably Crann DNA lead seemed significant to me.

I already knew that there was at least one Hann family living in Harbour Buffet where some of my wife’s ancestor came from. From the Newfoundland’s Grand Banks web site, I find this family in the 1921 census for Little Harbour East:

This gives a month and year for each person’s birth and tells us where they were born. Little Harbour East is not far from Harbour Buffet. Actually, it is even closer than I had now that I have some good information from Devon Griffin:

Unlike the other wrong Little Harbour East I had, the right one is across the bay from Harbour Buffet. Here is the marriage record:

It looks like Jessie was quite young. I wonder who Malinda was. Esther’s middle name is Alinda. A little over a month after this, it looks like the two witnesses wed:

Now it looks like the groom for the previous wedding was a witness. Hmm…

George Upshall

From an Ancestry tree, I did get that Jesse (or Jessie) Upshall’s father was George Upshall. Of course, I don’t see that Ancestry Tree at the moment. I had trouble finding George at Ancestry also, but I appear to have found him at FamilySearch. There, he is shown as marrying in 1896. This only works if this was a second marriage as his proposed daughter Jessie was born about 1890.

This shows that the marriage took place in Little Harbour East and that George was a widower. Both the groom and bride were living in Little Harbour East at the time of the wedding.

Another tree gives George as the father of Melinda Upshall. That leaves me with this tree:

Based on this, I’d like to make a guess as to a new proposed Crann/Upshall Tree:

A New Guess for a Crann/Upshall Tree

This tree supposes that a daughter of John Crann b. 1791 married an Upshall. That Upshall then had at least two sons. One was Henry b. 1841 and one was George b. 1857 shown in purple above. Henry and George could have carried down that Crann DNA to Esther and Elsie. I took out the arrow going from John Crann b. 1791 to the Elizabeth that married Christopher Dicks in red above. However, it now occurs to me that it would be possible that that arrow could still be there as there could be a Crann daughter in both slots – on the Upshall and Dicks side.

Let’s look at my AncestryDNA relationship chart again:

Ancestry thinks by the DNA that Elsie and Esther should be 3rd cousins. My chart has them as 3rd cousins, once removed. Ancestry has Elsie and Heather as 4th cousins. I show them as 5th cousins by the chart. The problem with what I did was that I didn’t follow the Chafe and Hann lines up to eliminate other possible Crann connections. However, I think that my chart gives a plausible solution to the DNA matches. It is satisfying to be able to propose some possible relationships based on logical assumptions after so many years of dealing with genealogical records that just don’t seem to exist in many cases.

Summary and Conclusions

  • This method works well with larger DNA matches
  • I started with a large match where there appeared to be a known common ancestor.
  • Based on that match and known ancestor, I developed trees based on other common DNA matches and common ancestries.
  • This method was helped by a non-Newfoundland match. This resulted in narrowing down the search to one surname.
  • Problems could result if I didn’t get the right surname to begin with
  • Other problems could result by not eliminating other possible genealogical connections
  • I drew a proposed tree to make sure the proposed relationships make sense time-wise. The tree also makes sure the proposed genealogical relationships match the ones proposed by the DNA relationships

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

A Dorset, Newfoundland and New Zealand Connection by DNA

Heather first contacted me through AncestryDNA. This was in December 2015. She lived in New Zealand and matched my wife’s great Aunt Esther. What I know about Esther was that all her ancestors came by way of Newfoundland and her line came from Harbour Buffet. I took a look at Heather’s Ancestry Tree and didn’t see any Newfoundland ancestors. I did see a Crann ancestor she had from Dorset, England. I had heard from someone who thought that Aunt Esther should have some Crann relatives (at least that was my memory – Hann is also a Harbour Buffet name). So I thought that this was interesting. Perhaps we could find an English connection for a Newfoundlander and a New Zealander.

Since that time, I recommended that Heather upload her results to Gedmatch and also join the Newfoundland Gedmatch Facebook group. She did that and I’d like to take a look at the DNA to see what may be found.

Genetic Relatives and Family Trees

First, here is the match between Heather and Esther:

The estimated number of generations to a common ancestor is 3.7. That could mean a few things. However, someone in the 3rd cousin range may be suggested. Here are Heather’s Crann ancestors:

Harold is Heather’s dad, so Samuel Crann would be out 4 generations from Heather.

Here are Esther’s ancestors:

Frederick and Margaret were Esther’s parents. Even at three generations back from Esther, there are a few gaps. Interestingly, looking up the Upshall name on the internet appears to link it to Dorset. The early records of Harbour Buffet mention a Peter and a Thomas Upshall. As a wild stab, I notice these two transcribed Upshall births from the Hazelbury Bryan Parish records in Dorset.

In the original records, Peter is referred to as ‘base-born’. Here is a map of Hazelbury Bryan showing proximity to nearby ports:

Below is Netherbury, where Heather’s ancestor Samuel Crann lived in the early 1800’s. He was a bit to the Southwest of my stab in the dark Upshalls.

Esther and My Mother in Law

My mother in law is Esther’s half niece. She is related through Esther’s paternal side only – barring intermarriage issues.

Here is how Heather matches my mother in law Joan:

This tells us that for these matches, Heather and Joan are matching more on the Upshall side rather than Esther’s Shave side. A slight point of confusion is that Esther has the Dicks family on her father’s and mother’s side.

A Triangulation Group?

It appears that Heather, Esther and Joan are in a Triangulation Group on Chromosome 1. That would mean that Heather, Esther and Joan should have a shared ancestor based on the DNA.

Heather to Esther:

Heather to Joan:

Esther to Joan to complete the triangle:

For some reason, there is a break in the Esther to Joan match. However, clearly there is a triangulation group (TG). That means that at least 2 out of 6 segment matches that Heather has with Esther and Joan are on the Upshall side.

AncestryDNA Shared Matches

So far, I have shown that at least part of the DNA match could be on the Upshall line. I have also shown that some Upshalls lived not too far from some of Heather’s ancestors in Dorset. The next step is to see if there are any Dicks family related to Heather. I have headed up quite a large Newfoundland Dicks family project. If Heather is related to Newfoundland Dicks, perhaps we would have already known that. One easy way to check is to check the Shared Matches at AncestryDNA.

This list shows two 3rd cousins and nine 4th cousins. Even though these are shared matches between Heather and Esther, the relationship shown here is to Esther.  The first person on the list comes up as a probable 3rd cousin to Esther. His name is Terence. When I choose him and then choose his shared matches, I see Heather on Terence’s Shared Match list as a possible 4th cousin. The bad news about Terence’s Ancestry Tree is that there are 4 people on it. The good news is that one of those four, his mother, is listed as a Crann.

Now I feel like I am getting somewhere. I feel like I should be focusing on the Upshall side of Esther’s tree. This, of course, is the side least known:

Esther and heather’s 2nd Shared match

Esther and Heather’s second shared match at AncestryDNA is Elsie. She is a possible 3rd cousin to Esther. Like Terence, Elsie is a possible 4th cousin to Heather. Like Terence she has an Ancestry Tree of 4 people. Her names are Chafe and Hann. Hann is a name that was known to be in Harbour Buffet, Newfoundland where Esther’s parents came from. Elsie also notes some ancestry from Placentia, Newfoundland. Harbour Buffet is in Placentia Bay. The Chafe name sounds familiar to me also.

So far, I have two interesting connections with the first two Shared Matches between Heather and Esther. Too bad my mother in law, Joan, is not also on AncestryDNA. At this point, I could try to work Terence’s and Elsie’s genealogy back up the Crann Line. However, I’ll keep looking at more Shared Matches. Now I’m down to Esther’s 4th cousins.

Fourth Cousin shared matches between Heather and esther

Now we are getting a bit further out. Rather than detailing each Shared Match, I have summarized my findings in a table.

My conclusion from all this is that there is a Crann/Netherbury, Dorset connection between Heather and Esther.

Building a Crann Tree

From here, I could look at the matches of the matches. This could get further out results that I don’t want. So instead, I’ll look to build out Terence’s four person tree. First, I will start a tree with the one Crann that he has in the tree. I find the one Crann in the 1930 Census:

This is helpful as it shows Arline’s parents, their ages, where they were born (Newfoundland) and where their parents were born (also Newfoundland).

Connecting the dots

Hopefully, I’m connecting the right dots. Here is John Crann’s World War II Registration:

This was helpful as it gives his John’s date and place. Here is Trinny Cove about 7 miles across the Bay from Harbour Buffet:

Here is a 1921 Census of Trinny Cove from a Newfoundland Genealogy website:

It looks like there were three houses in Trinny Bay and two of those were Crann houses. The two eldest Cranns were born in Harbor Buffett. I now have two potential sets of parents for John Crann, with my first choice being Richard. I do note that John’s first son was named Richard, so that adds weight to my assumption. In addition, his first daughter was named Julia.

Here’s John and Anastacia’s marriage on 8 Oct 1911, thanks to FamilySearch:

Bell Island is on the NE side of Newfoundland. At about this time I got stuck finding out the parents of John from the bottom up.

Richard crann b. 1856 b. harbour buffet

I thought why not check to see if there is a tree for Richard Crann from the Trinny Cove Census of 1921? I went on to Ancestry and found a familiar sounding Crann. Here was a Samuel Crann. His grandfather was listed as being from Netherbury, Dorset.

The Henry who had all the children was shown as being born in Jean de Baie, Placentia Bay, Newfoundland and dieing at Flat Islands, Newfoundland. Now I have made at least one connection between one Crann who was from Netherbury and moved to Newfoundland.

A Google search helped me find a Crann Families of Newfoundland Web Page:

RICHARD2 CRANN (CRANN1) was born December 1856 in Harbour Buffett, NF, and died December 13, 1941 in Fair Haven, NF.   He married JULIA REID  She was born September 1858 in Little Harbour, NF, and died October 20, 1940 in Fair Haven, NF.

Children of RICHARD CRANN and JULIA REID are:

JOHN BENJAMEN3CRANN

ELIZA CRANN , b.December 1877, Harbour Buffett, NF

ELIZABETH CRANN , b. November 1898, Trinny Cove, NF; m. JOHN PEDDLE; b. Corner Brook NF

What I’ve done:

  • I’ve connected Terrence to Esther and Heather by DNA.
  • I have also connected Terrence’s mom to the Newfoundland Cranns and more specifically a Crann born in Harbour Buffet.
  • I have also found a Crann family showing ancestry to Netherbury, Dorset, England.

What I haven’t done:

  • Haven’t connected the Newfoundland Cranns to Heather’s Cranns in Netherbury
  • Haven’t connected Esther’s family to the Cranns other than by location
  • Haven’t connected Terrence’s ancestor Richard Crann to earlier Cranns

So I’m about halfway there. Let’s look to see if we can connect Heather’s Cranns to this John Crann from Netherbury, Dorset.

John Crann Born 1791

This appears to be the record of John’s baptism in Netherbury:

Here is Heather’s Tree:

Here is a more fleshed out tree I found at Ancestry:

This tree shows that the Newfoundlander John Crann and New Zealander Samuel Crann were brothers. Talk about going different ways! This seems to make Henry Crann b. 1757 the common ancestor of Esther and Heather.

Wild Guessing Time

That’s about it for the research. Now I get to wildly guess and make assumptions. Assumption one is that John Crann’s brothers did not also move to Newfoundland. I have the William above died in England, the first John died young and Samuel went to New Zealand. I’m not sure what happened to the other Robert.

Another Crann Tree

While poking around Ancestry, I found yet another Crann Tree called Henwood. This tree seems to fill in a few blanks:

There are a few things I like about this tree. One thing is that it gives the spread of John Crann’s children from 1817 to 1836. Secondly, it shows a likely tie-in with one of Esther’s matches. Way up above in my Blog I mentioned that Heather, Esther and Terrence had a match with someone named Matson. Part of Matson’s tree looks like this:

It ended with one of Matson’s great grandmothers who was Marina Irene Crann b. 1877. It showed her husband as having died in Harbour Buffet. If I stitch the two trees together at Marina, I get a tree for Matson. While I’m at it, I’ll add Heather in. She’s in green for New Zealand.

Heather and Matson show up at AncestryDNA as 4th cousins with a possible range between 4th and 6th cousins. This tree shows them as 4th cousins, once removed. I’ll now add Terence’s Line and Esther’s Line.

A Proposed Crann Tree

At first, I had Esther’s tree up a generation, but that didn’t give any room for John Crann to have a daughter that could fit into Esther’s tree. Esther has two places where a Crann daughter could fit. One is the wife of an Upshall. The other is Elizabeth, wife of Christopher Dicks. From my diagram above, it looks like Terrence’s missing ancestor would have to be a son of John Crann. Under the above scenario, Esther would be a 4th cousin to Heather and a third cousin once removed to Terrence and Matson.

For a few reasons, I’m favoring the theory that a Crann married an Upshall. I suppose that Catherine Crann who I have in one tree as being born 1821, could have married Upshall in 1840 and had Henry Upshall in 1841.

Summary and Conclusions

  • Comparison of Crann Trees and Crann DNA matches lead to a suggested new Crann Tree
  • By carefully placing the separate trees together, it indicates where the missing Crann in the tree would likely go.
  • If more Crann descendants upload their DNA to Gedmatch, it could help verify these lines through triangulation.
  • It appears that there is more room for analysis. In my Excel spreadsheet of compared matches, there were multiple matches between Ninky, Elsie, Heather and Esther. However, that would make the blog too long.

 

More Dicks (and Joyce) DNA from Newfoundland

Thanks to the Newfoundland Gedmatch Facebook Group I recently ‘met’ a new Dicks descendant who had DNA tested. Trudy is from the Joyce Line of Dicks like many other in the Dicks DNA Project.

Trudy is in the bottom row of green DNA tested Dicks descendants. She is 7 generations away from Christopher Dicks b. about 1784. This is the main Dicks Line that I have been looking at. However Christopher had a brother of interest also named Henry.

dickstreetrudy

Seven generations is a long way away for autosomal DNA, but we will see what Trudy’s DNA shows us. As alluded to in the Blog Title, Trudy also has Joyce ancestry.

trudyjoycetree

On a certain day in the early 1800’s Rachel Dicks married James Joyce. They had at least seven descendants that had their DNA tested. And of course they had many descendants that didn’t have their DNA tested. Trudy’s closest relative in the chart above is Pauline. They are 1st cousins once removed.

Here is how Trudy matches the other Dicks descendants with tested DNA:

trudytotalcmtoall

That is a bit small, isn’t it? This shows no matches to the Henry Dicks Line, so we won’t need to look at them in this Blog. We can stick to the descendants of Christopher Dicks b. 1784.

Triangulation Groups

I tend to focus on Triangulation Groups (TGs). These are groups of people that match each other on the same segment. When this happens, it is a sure bet that the people in the TG have a common ancestor. There should be potentially two types of TGs that Trudy would be in: new ones and existing ones. The existing ones may tell us something, but the new ones should be more interesting. In addition, there is the possibility that Trudy could be in a Joyce TG, a Dicks TG, or even one from a different surname.

Downloaded segments

First, I download the matches of all the Christopher Dicks descendants and compare them. So I’m not re-creating the wheel, I’ll reproduce my TG Summary from a past Blog:

dickstgmatrixrev

The first interesting thing I see in my downloaded segments is here at the end of Chromosome 1:

tg1trudy

Trudy is in a TG with Esther and Forrest. Esther is my wife’s 1/2 great Aunt. Note that Judy and Wallace are not in this TG. They have plenty of other places to have their DNA match as they are niece and uncle.

tg1trudycircle

As far as I know, Esther, Trudy and Forrest all share the DNA from Christopher Dicks and his wife Margaret, so that is what it looks like this shared segment is (unless anyone else knows of a different shared ancestor in each of their ancestry).

The next interesting TG in chromosome 4

tg4trudy

Here I see Nelson, Molly and Trudy in a TG. This TG will be a little more challenging. Howie would also likely be in the TG if we were to lower the limits. One of the challenging things about this TG is that Molly descends from two Dicks Lines:

trudytg4circle

Nelson is from the Adams Line. Trudy is from the Joyce Line. Molly is from the Joyce and Cran Line. Nelson is Trudy’s 3rd cousin, three times removed. Nelson is Molly’s 3rd cousin, twice removed. Molly is Trudy’s 4th cousin once removed and 5th cousin, once removed. My guess is that Molly is related on the Joyce line as that would be closer to Trudy, but there is no way to know with certainty.

Moving right along.

Chromosome 5 TG – The Joyce family

Here I believe I see a Joyce TG:

tg5trudy

Pauline, Molly and Trudy all descend from the Joyce Line. Within that TG is another TG with Wallace, Joan and Esther. I had to take the match between Wallace and Esther down to find it, but it was there. Then again, we see the close Judy/Wallace relationship. They could match with Lewis DNA, for example.

trudyjoycetg

Untangling Chromosome 15

tg15trudy

Here is a TG with Trudy, Esther and Howie (Molly). Think of Howie and Molly as a tag team. As siblings, their DNA can be interchanged in many situations. Here we are missing a match between Esther and Molly. However, it would have to be there at a lower threshold.

There is a lot of mystery in this TG. I assume that the TG is Dicks. However, Molly and Howie are from 2 Dicks Lines and Esther has Dicks on her father and mother’s sides. On Esther’s mother’s side, I don’t know where her Dicks ancestors come from.

tg15trudychart

Here, the only unambiguous line (as far as I know) is between Trudy and Christopher Dicks by way of the Joyce Line. For Esther, Marilyn and Howie I am not as sure. Sandra and Cheryl listed above are both from the Adams Line of Dicks, so that is a likely source of shared DNA for those two.

TG Summary

This chart is getting large:

dickstgsummaryreg

Trudy is in 5 TGs. I think that 4 of them are new. Two of them appear to be Joyce TGs and three Dicks TGs.

 

 

Cathy’s DNA From the Newfoundland Dicks Family

The DNA results for Cathy just came in. She fits in on the Dicks/Burton Line here:

cathydicksburtonline

Cathy’s closest relative in the Dicks DNA Project is Denise (2nd cousin once removed). Here is how she matches everyone in the Project:

cathytoall

The first thing I noticed is that Cathy doesn’t match anyone in the Henry Dicks Line. They are in the rectangle to the lower right of the comparison. The Henry Dicks is believed to be a brother to Christopher Dicks b. 1784. As expected, Cathy’s largest match is with Denise.

Cathy and Esther at AncestryDNA

Cathy got my attention as she is mentioned in 2 New Ancestor Discoveries (NADs) at AncestryDNA. Esther is my wife’s 1/2 great Aunt. Esther and Cathy share many surnames including Dicks, Burton, Kirby and possibly Butler. When Ancestry sees that many people match by DNA and match by genealogy they give what is called a NAD. Actually, the others match each other by DNA, but they are not in Esther’s genealogy. That is why the note for Esther’s NADs says these are potential ancestors or relatives not already in Esther’s family tree:

esthernads

Here are the areas where Cathy and Esther match:

cathyesthermatch

The names above would be on Esther’s maternal side where she doesn’t match Joan. I checked gedmatch and Esther does not match Cathy and Joan in these three above segments. That means that it possible that these segments could represent the Kirby or Butler names as suggested by AncestryDNA.

Cathy and Triangulation

Now I will see who Cathy triangulated with in the Dicks Project. Triangulation is a more rigorous method than AncestryDNA uses. Triangulation means that 3 people match each other on the same Chromosome and the same segment of that chromosome. When this happens, those three (or more) have a common ancestor. This is helpful in verifying genealogy and finding new ancestors.

Cathy’s Triangulation Group (TG) at chromosome 2

There is already a Dicks TG at Chromosome 2 with Denise, Sandra, Joan and Nelson. Now Cathy has joined it.

cathytg2

All the people in the column to the right above should be in this TG.

cathytg2chart

I mention Molly and Kirsten as it is interesting that they are not in the TG. They are shown in purple circles.  It looks like they could have at least matched Cathy and Denise but did not. That means that they their match at this spot represents a different common ancestor than the others in the TG. One possibility is that The TG represents Christopher Dicks in the top circle and the match Molly and Kirsten have represents the wife (or it could be the other way around). Another possibility is that Molly and Kirsten have a separate common ancestor from the Dicks.

Cathy in a new TG (chromosome 5)

Sort of. This should have been a TG before.

cathytg5

Here we have a TG with Cathy, Nelson, Judy, and Wallace. The reason I didn’t have this TG before is because I found no match between Judy and Nelson. Now with Cathy in the mix, I see that Judy and Nelson should be in the TG. So I looked for a smaller match (between 5 and 7 cM) between Judy and Nelson and see that there was one right where we needed it for the TG.

tg5cathychart

It seems we know quite a bit about the DNA of Christopher Dicks and his wife Margaret. Here is the updated Dicks TG Matrix. This represents 20 DNA tested Dicks descendants and 33 TGs.

dickstgmatrixrev

Two New Christopher Dicks Descendants DNA Results

I recently came across two new Dicks descendants’ DNA results. One is for Cheryl and the other is Charles. They are both from the Christopher Dicks Line of Newfoundland, born 1784. The group is getting big, so here is part of the Christopher Line:

cherylcharles

Cheryl is important for the Adams line as now there are three there. Charles is important for the Burton Line as he also makes the third in that line. Plus he is the closest to the common ancestors of the line of Frances Dicks and Charles Burton.

Cheryl and Charles’ Newfoundland DNA

When I compare Cheryl to Nelson at gedmatch, it says that their common ancestor is 3.5 generations away. That is exactly what we should expect for these two as they are 2nd cousins, once removed. Here are Cheryl and Charles compared to the other 19 Dicks descendants’ DNA:

automatrixcherylcharles

I found it interesting that Cheryl and Esther were more closely related by DNA than Cheryl and Nelson. Remember Cheryl and Nelson were 2nd cousins once removed. However, Cheryl and Esther are 3rd cousins once removed. My guess is that Esther and Cheryl have some additional common ancestors.

The Dicks DNA Details: Triangulation Groups

Triangulation Groups (or TGs) are when 3 or more people have DNA that matches each other on the same chromosome and the same segment of that chromosome. When that happens, those 3 share a common ancestor. However, it may be difficult to determine who that common ancestor is. In a family project such as this, it is most likely that that common ancestor would be a Dicks ancestor or a spouse of a Dicks ancestor.

What I do is compare the detailed results of each of the 21 Dicks descendants in the project to look for TGs. Then it should be possible to draw some conclusions from those results.

Chromosome 1: One TG Or Two?

Here we have our 2 new Project people: Cheryl and Charles:

tg1cherylcharles

This is a new TG and it gets a little complicated right from the start. This is a four person TG, so there are different overlaps. If we look at this as 2 TGs, the first would go from 70M to 83M and the second TG would go from 83M to 106M. Here is how it looks from Cheryl’s point of view:

cherylchr1

#1 is Cheryl’s match to Esther. #2 is Joan showing where she comes into the TG later (in green). #3 is Charles. #4 is Wallace, #5 is Claude and #8 is Nelson – all outside the TG(s). I am tempted to call this one TG. One reason is that Joan and Charles match from 70M to 84M, going a little over the first 83M boundary of the TG. Also the same people are in both sections. It may be that Cheryl just had a poor DNA read in the section between her green and yellow sections of her matches.

Another possibility could be that this could represent 2 Dicks Lines. Recall we have a Henry Dicks Line and a Christopher Dicks line.

Here is what the new TG1 looks like on the Dicks Genealogy Chart:

tg1

Observe:

  • Sandra and Nelson match in this area, so their match is likely on the Mercer or Adams Line.
  • This is a non-Molly TG. She is in two other Dicks Lines. She matches Wallace in the area of this TG, so perhaps that match is on the Joyce Line.
  • Claude is thought to be in the Henry Dicks Line, but we are not sure.

TG9A Revised

I had already found a TG at Chromosome 9. Now Cheryl is added to that.

tg9a

This will look a lot like TG1 except that Kirsten is replacing Charles:

tg9achart

TG10 – Adams Or Dicks DNA?

tg10

Here is my guess for TG10, although technically, this TG could be pointing to either Elizabeth Dicks or Thomas Adams DNA:

tg10chart

TG13 – A Two Way Split

tg13ab

I split this existing TG13 into TG13A with Cheryl and TG13B with Judy. Kenneth and Gordon from the Henry Line are in both TGs.

tg13abchart

Here I have Gordon and Kenneth in red. Cheryl is in TG13A and Judy in yellow (TG13B). Again, this chart is focused on the Dicks family. There is a possibility that there could be another family in common between these lines that I don’t know about.

Chromosome 15 – A Lot Going On

chr15r

Here I see 2 TGs and some people that are not in the 2 TGs. First is Charles, Joan and Esther in gold. Then there is Nelson, Gordon, Charles, Kenneth and Judy in the pink TG. Howie, Molly and Pauline would be in a TG, but siblings are generally not considered as part of a TG trio. That is because they had to get all of their DNA from their parents, so it would be like 2 people if you consider Molly and Howie as their parent and Pauline as the other person.

Here are a few comments:

  • Pauline, Molly and Howie are likely matching DNA on their Joyce side
  • If the match with Gordon and Kenneth is a Dicks match, why don’t Charles, Esther and Joan also match them? Does that mean that the Charles, Esther, Joan TG is a non-Dicks TG?
  • I previously had TG15 split in two. It appears I can get it down to one TG with a common location between 51 and 62M on the Chromosome.
  • I had noted before that Gordon seems more closely related to the Christopher Dicks line than the Henry Dicks Line. He is also in TGs with the Christopher Dicks Line. Both his line and Esther and Joan’s line have a Christopher b. 1812 or 1813. Both Christopher ancestors are married to an Elizabeth. Gordon’s line identifies her as a Collier. Could it be that the lines are the same? Something to think about.

tgs15

Note that Charles is in two different TGs. The blue circles represent the non-TG with Molly, Howie and Pauline who have a Joyce ancestor.

New TG17

newtg17

The common area in this TG is between 30M and 37M. As this is likely a Dicks TG. Esther and Joan’s match likely represent the non-Dicks Upshall ancestry. This is important to know when checking matches in this area of the Chromosome.

Chromosome 18 – Two New Cheryl TGs

tgs18

Here is what Cheryl’s browser looks like:

cherylchr18

  • #1 Molly
  • #2 and #3: Sandra and Nelson (probably an Adams TG)
  • #5 and #6: Judy and Wallace

New Chromosome 20 TG

newtg20

Again, I am thinking that Charles may be related on the Upshall Line of Esther. Another possibility is the Burton line. Esther and Charles both have Burtons in their ancestry.

Updated Dicks Triangulation Matrix

I have made quite a few changes to the Dicks Triangulation Matrix:

dickstgmatrixnew

  • Gordon is in 5 TGs with the Christopher Dicks Line and in none with the Henry Dicks Line
  • Cheryl is in 7 TGs including 2 that appear to be non-Dicks TGs
  • Project members are in an average of 6 TGs each

Summary and Conclusions

  • Cheryl and Charles have added important DNA results to the Dicks family puzzle.
  • It looks from the DNA, common ancestral names and birth dates that Gordon could be more likely in the Christopher Line rather than the Henry Dicks Line. Someone who knows the genealogy better may be able to confirm this theory or refute it.
  • On the other hand, Charles is in TGs 4 out of 5 times with Kenneth. Is that significant?
  • It appears that Charles could have more of a connection to Esther and Joan than just the Dicks family. Both Esther and Charles have Burton ancestors. A connection with Esther and Joan’s Upshall line is an additional possibility.
  • It is possible to draw conclusions for matches that are in areas of a TG but are not in the TG. That means that those matches outside the TGs do not have the same common ancestors as those within the TG.

More Dicks DNA – Marilyn’s Brother

I just finished 2 Blogs on the Henry Dicks Line which is a parallel line to my wife’s Christopher Dicks Line. Then I heard that Marilyn had her brother tested. Marilyn is on 2 different Christopher Dicks Lines.

Henry Dicks Line Updates

In other news, I found out that Eric’s dad, Claude, has been tested for DNA. What is more it is Claude that Eric believes to be likely related on the Henry Dicks Line. The confusing part was that Eric was in a Triangulation Group with my mother in law Joan and Joan’s half Aunt Eshter. So isn’t that confusing. That means that for now (as I understand it) Eric’s TG with my wife’s side of the family may not refer back to a Dicks ancestor. I’ll take Eric off the TG Matrix for now and put his father into the Dicks family comparisons. The good news is that there are a lot of Dicks descendants around. The bad news is that is is difficult to keep track of all of them.

I also got this note recently from Crystal from the Henry Dicks Line:

In looking at Ivy’s ancestors, We also share another ancestor. We are both related to The Vatchers as well as the Matthews and the Dicks. Burgeo is so small that you bound to be related in 2 or 3 different ways going way back!

In addition, Crystal tells me she has extra Dicks DNA on her dad’s side as shown here on this Henry Dicks Chart. Her mom’s side of the Dicks line leads up to the first pink rectangle. I have Crystal in a slightly different green to make sure I don’t forget she is in two Dicks Lines.

henrychartnew

Back to the Christopher Dicks Line and Marilyn’s Brother

Here is an updated Christopher Line Chart. All I did was add Marilyn’s brother Howie to an old chart I had:

marilynsbrotherchart

The chart is getting tiny. So I will point out that Marilyn and her brother are on the Joyce and Cran Lines. The Joyce Line is the large Line to the right of center and the Cran Line is on the right. That reminds me of something I brought up in an email. My wife’s 1/2 great Aunt Esther has 2 Dicks Lines also. One is through Christopher. The other one she doesn’t share with Joan due to the 1/2 part. However, I noted that Esther is in 3 TGs that she does not share with Joan. In those 3, she shares all 3 of them with people from the Adams Line. The Adams line is the one on the left.

esthernonjoantgs

These are the non-Joan, Esther TGs. They all have Nelson in them and two of them have Sandra. I just need to check to see if Esther’s other Dicks ancestor might fit in. “Hi Sandra, any room for Esther’s ancestor?”

However, when I look at Esther’s tree, this is what I see:

estherstree

Assuming that this tree is right, there is no room for Jane Ann Dicks in Sandra’s tree. That is because Jane Ann was b. 1841 and Sandra descends from Elizabeth Dicks b. 1809 who married Thomas Adams. Sandra would have descended from a male Dicks. I will leave this as a mystery for now. Perhaps the 3 TGs above between Esther and Nelson are non-Dicks TGs.

Marilyn’s Brother and Claude

Now I will compare all those who have Dicks ancestors. I will look especially at Marilyn’s brother and Claude (Eric’s) dad who may have Dicks ancestors. This resulted in 754 lines of matches. However, each match is listed twice, so there are only 377 matches. A lot of these matches are between close relatives. There would be a lot more matches if I had included Eric and Larry in the mix.

Chromosome 2

Here we have a complicated stretch of DNA:

tg2dicks

This may take a bit of explaining. Previously, I had this as two TGs:

  • TG2D (180-192) with Sandra, Nelson, Denise and Joan
  • TG2E (201-209) with Sandra, Nelson and Marilyn

I see now that Denise should have been in the TG2E. Now we can add Howie to TG2E also. There is another way to look at this TG. That would be that it is a larger TG and that Joan’s DNA didn’t extend to the higher end of it and Marilyn and Howie’s DNA didn’t extend to the first part of it. A few other things:

  • Kenneth and Judy are not in this TG. As they both descend from a Miller line, that would be a likely source of their DNA match.
  • Kirsten also does not appear to be in the TG. I’m not sure how to explain the matches between Kirsten and Marilyn and Kirsten and Howie. The simplest explanation would be that Marilyn and Howie are in the TG through their father’s side and match Kirsten on their mother’s side. However, I don’t know enough about everyone’s genealogy to know if that is feasible.

Here is the larger TG drawn out:

tg2chart

This was a little tricky to draw. What this is supposed to represent is that Sandra, Nelson and Denise are in the larger TG. Joan (in yellow) is in the first part of it and Marilyn and Howie are in the second part or it. I guessed that Marilyn and Howie might be in the box on the right as none of the other four Joyce line descendants are in this TG.

crossovers

I can give a likely reason Joan dropped out of this TG and Marilyn and Howie dropped in. It has to do with crossovers. Let’s look at Joan first. Joan has 2 copies of her Chromosome 2 as we all do. One is maternal and one is paternal. Joan’s Dicks DNA comes from her maternal side. Joan’s maternal DNA is made up of her mother’s two parents DNA joined together (recombined). Those 2 parents were Joan’s grandfather Frederick Upshall and grandmother Daly. Joan’s maternal Chromosome 2 is alternating between Upshall (whose mother was a Dicks) and Daly.

Here is a map of my actual Chromosome 2 showing the alternating pattern:

joelchr2

This chart was created by M MacNeill [prairielad_genealogy@hotmail.com]. It is possible to map this out if you have 2 parents tested, or if you have one tested and 2 or 3 siblings tested. There is even a way to map your grandparents with siblings and no parent tested. In the case above. Light blue represents my maternal grandmother and dark blue is my maternal grandfather. The light red is my paternal grandmother and the dark red is my paternal grandfather. Everyone’s DNA follows the same type of pattern. The actual configurations where the changes are will be different. The place where a color goes from one to another is called a crossover. Sometimes there is no crossover or recombination and you will have all your DNA on a particular copy (maternal or paternal) of a chromosome from one grandparent instead of two.

Back to the TG at Chromosome 2:

chr2joan

Notice what Joan’s matches with Sandra, Denise and Nelson have in common: they all end around 192M. That should be the place where Joan’s DNA switches from her grandpa Upshall to grandma Daly.

Here is Joan’s Chromosome 2:

joanchr2

This shows her matches with:

  1. Esther
  2. Nelson
  3. Sandra
  4. Denise

To the right of the one blue bar on top of the 2 green bars is where Joan drops out of this Dicks TG. I can almost map Joan’s Maternal grandparents from this gedmatch chromosome broswer. Here is my guess:

joanchr2map

A few notes:

  • Joan’s Daly grandmother is not from Newfoundland
  • Another possibility could be that the Upshall segment could extend to Joan’s matches with #2, 3, and 4, eliminating the first Daly segment I have.

Another interesting question is: Why doesn’t Esther match Joan where Joan matches Nelson, Sandra, and Denise? The answer would be that Esther has Upshall DNA in this area rather than Dicks and Joan got Dicks DNA in this area. It’s a bit confusing as you have to picture what is happening on each side of the match between Esther and Joan.

Marilyn and Howie’s appearance in TG2

I’d like to bring up an interesting point about siblings. Siblings represent the only relationship where you will find appreciable FIRs. FIRs are Fully Identical regions. Here is Marilyn’s match with her brother Howie on Chromosome 2:

marilynhowiechr2

This shows that Marilyn and Howie match each other along the blue line. That is from 0 to 147M. Then they don’t match from 147M to 182M. Then they match again to the end of the Chromosome 2. Above the blue bar are green and yellow areas. The yellow is how we match everyone other than siblings. The green is the FIR. That means a double match. As siblings, Marilyn and Howie share all their 4 grandparents: 2 Paternal and 2 Maternal grandparents. Looking at Marilyn and Howie’s Chromosome 2, I can know what the green, yellow and red regions mean:

  • Green – Marilyn and Howie both share a maternal grandparent and a paternal one. We just can’t tell which one right now.
  • Yellow – Marilyn and Howie both share a maternal grandparent or a paternal grandparent. Again we can’t tell which one right now.
  • Red – Marilyn and Howie share the DNA of neither their maternal nor paternal grandparent.

Here is the 2nd part of the TG at Chromosome 2:

tg2marilynhowie

The appearance of Marilyn and Howie in this TG is clear: 201M. I just found out recently that there is a way to expand matches to great detail as shown in the Gedmatch Chromosome Broswer. Here is Marilyn and Howie expanded at around 201M:

marilynhowiechr2-201

This is difficult to see. The number in the middle is 200M. That is one tick mark away from 201 where Marilyn and Howie enter the TG. Another interesting thing is that Marilyn (Molly) above gets out of the TG at 208 and Howie gets out between 212 and 218.  What does all this mean?

  • Based on the expanded view, Marilyn and Howie are FIR from a little after 195M. They jump into the TG at 201. FIR means that Marilyn and Howie share the same 2 grandparents – one maternal and one paternal. However, without the comparison of another sibling, this is difficult to see. I am assuming that from 195 to 201M, Marilyn and Howie share the same 2 grandparents, but not necessarily the same two as after 201M. At 201M, Marilyn and Howie both get their DNA from their paternal grandmother Sarah Priscilla. Sarah is the one with Dicks DNA.
  • At 208M, Marilyn drops out of the TG before Howie.

Here is an expanded view of an already expanded view of Marilyn and Howie at 208M:

chr2-210

Every little tick mark [^] is 1M. So 2 ^’s before 210M is 208M. That is where Marilyn and Howie go from FIR to HIR. An HIR is a Half Identical Region. That means that Marilyn and Howie match one grandparent (on the maternal or paternal side) and they don’t match the other grandparent (on the opposite of the maternal or paternal side where they do match). This is easier to show by mapping it out:

chr2map

It is clear that from 201 to 208, that Marilyn and Howie are in a TG. They are also FIR. That means that they have 2 grandparents the same (one paternal and one maternal, here represented by blue and yellow). The TG identifies the paternal grandparent as Sarah. She is the one that descends from the Dicks family. We don’t know which Maternal grandparent that Marilyn and Howie got their DNA from. We just know that it is the same grandparent.

At 208M, two things happen. Marilyn exits the TG and is now in an HIR with her brother Howie. HIR means that Marilyn gets her DNA from one grandparent (on the maternal or paternal side). On the other side from where she gets her DNA, she doesn’t get her DNA from the other. In this case, that means that she continues to match the same maternal grandparent and switches the paternal grandparent that she gets her DNA from from Sarah to Jesse.

All this is to say that it is helpful to have a sibling or more tested.

Chromosome 12

Like the TG at Chromosome 2, the TG that Howie is in at Chromosome 12 is not new. It has been described previously. Here is what it looks like in a spreadsheet:

tg12howie

The difference is that there is a Joyce Line TG within an apparent Dicks TG (in gold). Also within the gold TG there are single matches of people from the Henry Dicks Line. That could mean a few things:

  • The green matches are in non-Dicks lines
  • The green matches are with Dicks lines. If that is true, that would mean that the gold TG must point back to the wife of Christopher Dicks who I have as Margaret b. 1789.

In TG2, I had missed Denise in part of the TG. Previously I had missed Pauline in this one. Part of the reason I may have missed Denise in TG2 is that her match with Marilyn was less than 7 cM so didn’t show up at Gedmatch at threshold levels. In this case Marilyn doesn’t match Pauline, because she drops out of the TG right around the spot where Pauline joins in the TG (127M).

Here is Joan compared with Esther, Howie, Marilyn and Pauline:

joanchr12

In the above browser image, Joan’s maternal grandparent mapping would likely go Upshall, Daly, Upshall. One can see where Howie and Marilyn jump into the TG in the 2 yellow bars. You can also see how Marilyn (#3) jumps out of the TG on the right and Pauline (#4) jumps in (green bar).

For comparison, I will show the same matches from Esther’s point of view:

estherchr12

Esther’s view has to be exactly the same for #1 as they are comparing the same 2 people (Joan and Esther). Esther’s view gives a crisper indication of Marilyn’s crossover.

Chromosome 12 is shorter than Chromosome 2, so it should be simpler. Here are Marilyn and Howie compared at Chromosome 12:

mhchr12

Marilyn and Howie have 3 HIR’s, one FIR and one area where they don’t match either of their grandparents. In that area where they don’t match, if Marilyn got her DNA from her her maternal grandmother and paternal grandfather, for example, it would mean that Howie would have to get his DNA from his maternal grandfather and paternal grandmother.

We have more detail on the positions from the TG:

tgpauline

Howie and Molly jump into the TG at 114M. Molly jumps out at 126M and Howie jumps out at 132M. Actually, he had to as that is the end of the Chromosome!

Looking at Marilyn and Howie’s expanded view of Chromosome 12, their FIR starts at 101M. That switches to an HIR at about 126.5M. That corresponds where Marilyn gets out of the TG. It also corresponds where the green goes to yellow in the Gedmatch Chromosome browser in the image above.

mh12map

This looks similar to the Chromosome 2 map of Marilyn and Howie. This time I was a bit more brave due to my experience with Chromosome 2 and mapped their DNA to the beginning of their HIR rather than just to the beginning of where they jumped into the TG (113M). The reason for this is for there to be a change at 113M would require a double crossover for these two which is unlikely. Another note is that the yellow grandparent in this example may not be the same as the yellow one in Chromosome 2. It is just meant to represent one of the maternal grandparents in each case.

One More Question On Crossovers

I’m learning this as I go along. I had determined a crossover above at 126.5M above where one sibling left the TG and the other stayed in. However, I did not have a crossover at 114M where both siblings entered the TG. Why is that? I had a crossover at 126.5 because the chromosome browser verified that the siblings were switching from a FIR to an HIR at 126.5. To me, this verified the crossover in conjunction with the change in TG at the same location. At 114M, there was no change:

chr12pos114m

Above is the close-up view of Marilyn’s match to Howie on Chromosome 12 between positions 110 and 120M. The whole area on either side of 114M is FIR. That likely indicates no crossover at Marilyn’s and Howie’s grandparent level. However, it was Marilyn’s great grandmother Bertha Joyce that had her grandparents’ Dicks and Joyce DNA recombining into a crossover. It is likely that this TG represents the DNA that Bertha Joyce received from her grandparents probably sometime around the American Civil War. I note that the TG that I looked at above at Chromosome 2 followed the same pattern. The crossover was where one sibling left the TG and the other remained. Where the two siblings started in the TG, there was no change in the FIR region to an HIR.

So the answer is that there was a crossover at some point at position 114M, but quite a while before the time period that we are looking at here. So it is hidden in my map above.

Dicks TG Matrix Update

dicksmatrixupdate

  • Here I took out Eric as his father Claude (who is believed to be the one descended from the Dicks family) was not found to be in a TG. Eric was in a TG with Joan and Esther, but that must have been on his maternal (non-Dicks) side.
  • I didn’t add 2 extra columns for Howie, but put him in the appropriate boxes where the existing TGs for his sister Marilyn were.
  • I added Denise to TG2E and Pauline to TG12B. That was an important addition for Marilyn and Howie as it seem to indicate that their Dicks DNA comes from the Joyce rather than the Cran Line in this case. Recall that in TG2E, I was suggesting that this might represent the Cran line for Marilyn and Howie.

The All-Dicks Comparison

autosomalmatrix

The top left box are the Christopher Line descendants. The bottom right box is the Henry Dicks Line descendants. This now includes Claude and Howie. For an interesting comparison, run down the two columns of Molly and Howie and see how the total cMs of their matches differ.

Summary and Conclusions

  • I didn’t add any new TGs by the addition of Marilyn’s brother Howie and Eric’s father Claude.
  • Marilyn and Howie are the first known Dicks descendant siblings to have their DNA tested. So I took advantage of that to explain how crossovers work and how they are important in mapping DNA.
  • The combination of the sibling comparisons and TGs made it possible to partially map two of Marilyn’s and Howie’s paternal grandparents on portions of Chromosomes 2 and 12.
  • I also showed a likely scenario for Joan’s crossover point within a TG which would lead to mapping segments that she received from her maternal grandparents
  • I clarified a few issues and refined the Dicks Triangulation Group Matrix

 

 

The DNA of Henry Dicks of Newfoundland b. 1774: Part 2

In my last blog, I gave some updated information on the DNA matches of descendants of Henry Dicks of Newfoundland. As I was writing the blog, new DNA was being uploaded to gedmatch.com. Perhaps the most important results for the Henry Dicks group were tokenized between the last Blog and this one. Those were the DNA results of Gordon. Here is why his results are so important:

henrydickschart

You might say that Gordon is higher up on the ladder than the other Henry Dicks descendant DNA testers. That makes all his relationships to other Dicks ancestors closer by a generation or more.

Step 1: All Gordon’s Matches

The first thing I do when I look at new results is run a ‘one to many’ at Gedmatch. That shows all the matches Gordon has.

gordontopmatches

Out of Gordon’s top 13 matches, 6 are already in our group. Larry is his son. Kenneth, Nelson, and Judy were mentioned in the previous blog. Esther is my wife’s great aunt. Esther and Nelson are one rung up the ladder from Gordon – closer to a common ancestors.

Step 2: All Gordon’s Dicks Descendant Matches

The next utility I use at Gedmatch is called the Multiple Kit Analysis. Here I’ll look at 18 Dicks descendants at once and compare them to each other:

gordonmatixmod

The first 6 testers are from the Henry Dicks Line. The 2nd 12 are from the Christopher Dicks Line. The numbers are in cM and represent the closeness of their DNA matches. I don’t have the names going across the top, but the order is the same as going down. The first grey box in the top right is grey because it represents Gordon’s match with himself. The next box shows that Gordon and Ivy match each other at a level of 14.2 cM.

Now, how to interpret this?

  • Shannon has poor matches overall, so we will look at her Uncle Dennis’ results instead
  • Gordon and Eric seem to have larger matches with the Christopher Dicks Line as compared to the Henry Dicks line. There may be more than one explanation for this.
  • Ivy, Dennis and Crystal have higher matches with Henry Dicks descendants than they do with Christopher Dicks descendants.
  • Dennis and Crystal share a common ancestor of Henry Harold Dicks b. 1811. That explains their larger match.
  • Crystal and Ivy share Dicks and Matthews ancestors. That would explain their larger match.

Step 3: Dicks Triangulation

Triangulation Groups or TGs have been called the gold standard of genetic genealogy. In this step I download all the specific matches from the last chart. The specifics are what Chromosome the matches are on and what location on the chromosome that the matches are on. These go into a spreadsheet of 608 lines. This represents 304 shared Dicks descendants’ DNA. Not all the DNA is from Dicks. The closer the relationship that is looked at between the 2 people, the more likely the match is not representing Dicks DNA.

Chromosome 6 TG

The first TG that Gordon is in is fairly straightforward.

tg6spreadsheet

The gold area is the area of the TG. There are 3 other matches that could be in the TG but aren’t. They don’t even match with people within the TG. For that reason, my assumption is that they match on the non-Dicks side of the realtionship. For Wallace and Judy that would be their Lewis ancestors. Likewise the Mercer ancestors are likely represent on Chromsome 6 for Nelson and Sandra. For Joan and Esther, the large segment they share is likely Upshall DNA. So the TG helps not only those that are in the TG, but those that could be but aren’t.

Here is the Dicks TG on Chromosome 6 displayed on the genealogy chart:

tg6chart

So the fact that Gordon is in TGs with those in another line of the Dicks family doesn’t mean that Gordon is not in the Henry Dicks Line. It just means that there are more outside his line to match and the relationships outside the Henry line are as close as those within. For example, the relationships here are 5th cousins. The relationship Gordon has with the person to his lower right in the Henry line is 4th cousin twice removed. That is equivalent to a 5th cousin.

Chromosome 15 TG

This is the one I mentioned I would address later in my previous Blog. Now is later. This one is a little more complicated, so I took out the double match entries to simplify it:

tg15ss

This is a 4 person TG, so there are more matches. However, within the TG are 2 non-TG matches. These are likely for the Upshall and Joyce Lines. I wasn’t going to draw out the genealogy chart TGs, but doing so illustrates a few points:

tg15chart

Here the patriarch, assumed to be Christopher Dicks, is at the top of the orange TG. The first point I wanted to make is that Gordon is a 4th cousin once removed to Nelson. That is a closer relationship than he has with those currently in his own Henry Dicks Line. The second point I tried to make showing the blue TG. The blue TG is the existing TG which consists of those within the Christopher b. 1789 (son of Christopher) TG. There is even a 3rd point. Assume that Gordon does not descend from Christopher b. 1789 (and I have no evidence that he does). This diagram shows a pretty rock solid intertwined pair of TGs. The first TG identified Christopher b. 1789 and the second one identified that there is also a TG leading up to the patriarch Christopher. In other words, this is proof to me that Henry and Christopher Dicks are brothers. Finally, the above can be seen as one or two TGs. I would prefer to keep them separate as one identifies one ancestor and the other identifies older Christopher ancestor.

Chromosome 17 TG – Hold on to your seats

The ride may get a bit bumpy on this next TG. Here is Chromosome 17 from about 52M-78M:

tg17two

Here, we have the TG found in the previous Blog with Dennis, Crystal and Wallace from about 52M-64M. Then after that is a new TG with Gordon, Nelson, and Esther from about 58M-72M. So that shows 2 TGs with different people in them, but the TGs overlap a bit. Then after that are two matches. One is between Forrest and Esther that would have to be outside the TG. The other is between Nelson and Sandra that would also be outside the TG.

These two TGs have has me a bit stumped. I have a few theories:

  1. This could be due to endogamy. Esther has Dicks on her father’s and mother’s side
  2. Could it be that one TG represents the patriarch Christopher’s DNA and the other represents his wife’s DNA? In that case we would be seeing a sort of mid 1700’s phasing?
  3. Another option is that these 2 TGs represent common ancestors from different lines.

I suppose it won’t hurt to draw these 2 out.

2tg17s

Given that the chart is geared toward the Dicks Line in general, it would tend to favor Theory #2. Does anyone else have any ideas?

A Note on Ivy and crystal

In a previous Blog on the Henry Line, I had identified a TG with Esther, Joan, and Crystal. Here is what it looks like in gold on the current spreadsheet:

tg5ivy

Note that Crystal is conspicuously missing from this TG. Well, not that conspicuous as I didn’t notice at first. I was looking at Ivy/Crystal DNA matches, because at the top of the blog, I had noted they matched each other more than usual because they both shared not only the ancestor of Henry Dicks but also shared a common Matthews ancestor. Now we have a TG on Chromosome 5 between Esther, Joan and Crytal. We assume that TG represents Dicks DNA and a common ancestor of the patriarch Christopher Dicks. That means that between 73M and 111M Esther and Joan share Dicks DNA. Then why do Crystal and Ivy match each other and not match Esther and Joan from 77M to 85M? A likely explanation is that location is where they share Matthews DNA. This also means that at some point between 85M and 90M, Crystal has a crossover. This particular crossover is where the DNA she received crossed over from Matthews to Dicks or more specifically from John Matthews to  Fanny Dicks.

crystalivy

So we can identify very specifically from this TG, the exact ancestor that Crystal got her DNA from in these two segments of Chromosome 5. Usually we can just know it is one or the other ancestor. We have essentially phased Crystal’s 2nd great grandfather William Matthew’s DNA into a paternal and maternal side.

There are other likely implications from this TG

  • Wallace and Judy probably share Miller DNA in their Chromosome 5 segment above
  • Pauline and Kenneth likely share Joyce DNA in this area of Chromosome 5
  • Molly and Kenneth likely share Joyce DNA in this area of Chromosome 5

Now look at the last two bullets. If Kenneth shares Joyce DNA with Pauline and Molly, why do Pauline and Molly not share Joyce DNA with each other? The answer is that they do:

newjoycetg

So while finding a non-Dicks match within a Dicks TG, I found a separate non-Dicks TG. These 2 TGs, like the Chromosome 17 TGs are overlapping TGs to some extent. However, unlike the Chromosome 17 TGs, I was able to explain these 2 overlapping TGs at Chromosome 5. Perhaps what I have learned at Chromosome 5, I will be able to apply to Chromosome 17. But not now.

My Dicks Family TG Summary Table

This is a sort of a fingerprint of the Dicks TGs to date.

tgsumtable

A few notes:

  • I have the new (non-Dicks) Joyce TG I mentioned above as TG5A in a raspberry color
  • Here I split out TG 15A and 15B. 15A goes with Christopher Dicks b. 1789 and 15B goes with his father Christopher.
  • TG17A & B are the problem ones!
  • Gordon is in the most Henry Line TGs
  • The dark green TGs represent the common ancestor of the patriarch Christopher Dicks and his wife. The light green represent Christopher Dicks b. 1789, the son of the patriarch.
  • There is still no TG just within the Henry Dicks Line. A lot of that is due to there being no critical mass there yet. There needs to be a few more Henry Line testers for that to happen.

Summary and Conclusions

  • The addition of Gordon’s results have resulted in some more Dicks TGs
  • G17A and 17B were a problem as these were 2 overlapping TG – making it difficult to interpret the results
  • TG16A & B were interesting as they appear to show a definite link between the Henry and Christopher Lines and a link between the father Christopher and his two sons.
  • There appears to be no reason to question the genealogy chart as posted
  • I was able to find some non-Dicks DNA while looking at TGs. What other secrets are lurking out there deep within our DNA?
  • It has been interesting watching the Dicks DNA project expand.